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RA2 demake on TS engine
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NimoStar
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Joined: 07 Nov 2012
Location: Buenos Aires

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2019 1:41 am    Post subject:  RA2 demake on TS engine Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Has something like it ever been done?

I imagine it is possible to resize faction structures, infantry and voxels.

Structures and infantry could have their colors darkened to fit TS scenarios (I have custom Cs schemes for just this task)

Voxels would automatically be darker since TS uses only 16 light and RA2 32.

Does Rampastein's CnCNet Launcher support three factions? Or custom MCVs/conyards? (both factions use the same on regular TS)

If not, what would be the best solution? (ares-like addons for TS?)

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E1 Elite
General


Joined: 28 May 2013

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2019 3:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Resizing RA2 stuff for TS is not new, it is going on from the beginning. Additional factions are also possible with TS engine with hacks (Tutorial).

But you won't get features like mind control, the newer stuff added by Ares and there are plenty of smaller things like no rotor anim for heli.

Basically, you would be downgrading most of it except the features those were removed from RA2 when compared to TS, like in-game deformation, ice growth etc. But TS is free.

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NimoStar
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Joined: 07 Nov 2012
Location: Buenos Aires

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2019 3:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Well, I don't measn resizing stuff but porting most of the game.

I don't mind (ha!) about mind control that much, etc. it would be a sort of "creative interpretation" where missing features are replaced by others.

There are practical uses like you mentioned:
- TS features, some not remade by ares (terrain deformation and ice are big ones)
Others include:
- Buildable concrete
- Veinhole monsters, vein superweapons, etc.
- EMP equals damage dealt, with weapon verses, spread, etc. considered
- Ion storms and its effects on weapons
- TS being free everyone can get your mod without piracy.

Plus, using TS downloadable assets, TS terrain without pixelation, TS civilian buildings, etc.

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Mig Eater
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Joined: 13 Nov 2003
Location: Eindhoven

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2019 6:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Buildable concrete can be done in vanilla RA2 & EMP damage can be done with Ares.

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OmegaBolt
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Joined: 21 Mar 2005
Location: York, England

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2019 2:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

You can make Ion storms too with a map wide weather storm and warheads that EMP aircraft & hover units. The amount of features you're losing vs the amount you gain is way higher.

Quote:
Well, I don't measn resizing stuff but porting most of the game.
But you'd have to downsize all the stuff for it to fit the TS tile size properly.

Quote:
TS being free everyone can get your mod without piracy
If you're including RA2 assets in your mod then its still piracy. #Tongue  Converting one game to another doesn't evade the illegality.

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Graion Dilach
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Location: Iszkaszentgyorgy, Hungary

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2019 4:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

OpenRA actually has less missing RA2/YR/Ares logics than TS logics at this point IMO. TBH - probably because I put a lot of effort to have a fork which got them, but still.

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^Rampastein
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2019 6:28 pm    Post subject: Re: RA2 demake on TS engine Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

NimoStar wrote:
Does Rampastein's CnCNet Launcher support three factions? Or custom MCVs/conyards? (both factions use the same on regular TS)

I originally developed the client for DTA which has 4 factions, so yes.

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NimoStar
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Joined: 07 Nov 2012
Location: Buenos Aires

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2019 8:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Quote:
You can make Ion storms too with a map wide weather storm and warheads that EMP aircraft & hover units. The amount of features you're losing vs the amount you gain is way higher.


Only partially true.  There are at least these missing features in this:

- The TS lightning bolts use a special random draw effect.
- Grounded aircraft and hover units =/= emped by lightning
- No alternate weapon for ion storm mechanics

Quote:
But you'd have to downsize all the stuff for it to fit the TS tile size properly.


Yes, I said that. However if you got links for it, better...

Quote:
If you're including RA2 assets in your mod then its still piracy. #Tongue  Converting one game to another doesn't evade the illegality.


Since we have been using conversions since forever I think that argument is obsolete. The converted asset for all intents and purposes counts as a "new" asset. In any case, use of custom RA2 assets is possible in place of the originals, since we have many variations.

Quote:
I originally developed the client for DTA which has 4 factions, so yes.


Cool. I assume the way to make it work is still the one in the guide? (with CPUs having to "autodeploy" their "starting units", etc.?)

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OmegaBolt
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Joined: 21 Mar 2005
Location: York, England

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2019 9:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Quote:
- The TS lightning bolts use a special random draw effect.
- Grounded aircraft and hover units =/= emped by lightning
- No alternate weapon for ion storm mechanics
-That lightning effect has been converted to RA2 into SHPs, which you can do. You wouldn't even notice the difference.
- What's the real difference between grounded aircraft / hover units and EMP? They can't take off when effected and they crash when in the air... same as EMP. With Ares you can even disable the EMP animation.
- Not sure what you mean by no alternate weapon for IS mechanics... you can, with Ares, nicely separate the EMP and damage if that's what you were talking about.

Quote:
Since we have been using conversions since forever I think that argument is obsolete. The converted asset for all intents and purposes counts as a "new" asset.
Not legally. One of your reasons for doing this was to evade piracy, and you are not, that's all. Whether players or modders care is one thing, but they also likely wouldn't care if someone pirated RA2.

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NimoStar
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Joined: 07 Nov 2012
Location: Buenos Aires

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2019 9:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Quote:
Whether players or modders care is one thing, but they also likely wouldn't care if someone pirated RA2.


Well since the versions of RA2 mods that came with the base game were quickly deleted, apaprently at least in this forum they care :V

[quote]-That lightning effect has been converted to RA2 into SHPs, which you can do. You wouldn't even notice the difference.
- What's the real difference between grounded aircraft / hover units and EMP? They can't take off when effected and they crash when in the air... same as EMP. With Ares you can even disable the EMP animation.
- Not sure what you mean by no alternate weapon for IS mechanics... you can, with Ares, nicely separate the EMP and damage if that's what you were talking about. [quote]

- Only three anims for RA2 lightnings while unlimited dynamically generated anims of TS lightnings...
- The real difference is plenty. For example, RA2 weapons have a limited spread. THe spread is pseudo-spherical too so it is less on air than on ground. Thus it would only work in the vicinity of the lightning impact. Not only that but you need to use the same warhead than for the damage (and this warhead should not affect anything not "emped" by ion storm, thus doing no damage to them either, and the damage radious would be the "EMP" radius). While TS Ion Storm restrictions instantly affect the whole map, and lightnings only deal damage as normal.
- No, that isn't it. In TS, some units would have weapons that disable with an Ion Storm, and then would then come to use an alternate weapon. See "Eclipse Tank" for Twisted Insurrection for an example. I don't remember the ones from vainilla TS.

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OmegaBolt
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Location: York, England

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2019 10:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

NimoStar wrote:
- Only three anims for RA2 lightnings while unlimited dynamically generated anims of TS lightnings...
You are not limited to 3 with Ares. Wink  Though it would make no difference to users if theres infinite slight variation anyway.

NimoStar wrote:
- The real difference is plenty. For example, RA2 weapons have a limited spread. THe spread is pseudo-spherical too so it is less on air than on ground. Thus it would only work in the vicinity of the lightning impact. Not only that but you need to use the same warhead than for the damage (and this warhead should not affect anything not "emped" by ion storm, thus doing no damage to them either, and the damage radious would be the "EMP" radius). While TS Ion Storm restrictions instantly affect the whole map, and lightnings only deal damage as normal.
Again, Ares removes the cellspread limit. You can have a warhead that effects the entire map. As I said, you can also separate the EMP from the damage and have two warheads triggered.

NimoStar wrote:
- No, that isn't it. In TS, some units would have weapons that disable with an Ion Storm, and then would then come to use an alternate weapon. See "Eclipse Tank" for Twisted Insurrection for an example. I don't remember the ones from vainilla TS.
There were no ones in vanilla TS that did that. The IonSensitive tag that disables weapons in storms doesn't exist in YR yeah, but i's such a tiny feature, not sure what you could do with it that's more than a novelty.

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NimoStar
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Location: Buenos Aires

PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2019 4:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Quote:
You are not limited to 3 with Ares. Wink  Though it would make no difference to users if theres infinite slight variation anyway.


It would make a difference. My eyes tire of seeing the same animation over and over again. It is also why tesla bolts are different every time.

Quote:
Again, Ares removes the cellspread limit. You can have a warhead that effects the entire map. As I said, you can also separate the EMP from the damage and have two warheads triggered.


That each lightning effects the entire map with emp would be incredibly laggy, specially in older machines - such as my own.

You can't have two warheads triggered with the Lightning Storm superweapon, that I know of?

Quote:
There were no ones in vanilla TS that did that. The IonSensitive tag that disables weapons in storms doesn't exist in YR yeah, but i's such a tiny feature, not sure what you could do with it that's more than a novelty.


Having every other unit have a primary weapon for the Ion Storm and a secondary one for without is much more than a "novelty", having units which have *stronger* weapons on ion storms (such as Prism beams and Tesla bolts being much stronger), having units which cannot fire on ion storms, units with weaker attack, or that gain different effects, etc. etc.

Really, this to me is a great and underappreciated feature, essentially gives you an "alternate battlefield". Not "tiny" at all, maybe in coding, but not in function.

If Ares adds this, I would definitely not do the port.

(Still, things like ice, vein weapons, terrain deformation, concrete, etc. are nice bonuses)

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ApolloTD
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Joined: 19 Nov 2003

PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2019 5:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Go on Nimostar, should be small enough mod plan for your skills to produce  Laughing

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NimoStar
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Joined: 07 Nov 2012
Location: Buenos Aires

PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2019 6:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Do you have any idea of the complexity and effort of making a mod like this?

To start with, you need to change all the offsets in the resized art for the structure anims. It is f'king huge.

And that's not even starting with the implementation problems of RA2 abilities, weapons and behaviors (there is no "ballonhover" on TS, no radiation, no tesla, etc. etc.)

so... crawl back.

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Lin Kuei Ominae
Seth


Joined: 16 Aug 2006
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2019 6:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Are you schizophrenic? 2 persons sharing the same account?
First you fight tooth and nail to get supporters for your idea, and now you say all the work isn't worth it?
Thanks for wasting everyones time involved in this topic.

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NimoStar
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2019 8:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I never said it isn't worth it. Are you stupid, or blind? Can you even read?

I said it isn't EASY or SIMPLE.

I didn't say I wasn't going to do it.

Thank you for wasting my time in the topic.

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Volgin
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2019 9:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Why the ztype would you even bother in this day and age?

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NimoStar
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2019 10:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Already said, to make a free version of RA2.

However the negative people on this forum sure depress me.

Either "its stupid because its easy" or "you will never do it because its hard", both with completely out of context personal insults to merely technical assertions and questions.

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Lin Kuei Ominae
Seth


Joined: 16 Aug 2006
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2019 6:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

NimoStar wrote:
Already said, to make a free version of RA2.

Wrong, RA2 assets are not free. You would be ripping assets.
Using public remakes isn't really RA2.
It's especially not RA2, when 80% of all special functionalities are missing and the game dumbed down to simple conventional weaponry for every unit.

Not possible:
-V2
-Carrier->HornetLauncher
-Dreadnought->DredLauncher
-Yuri mindcontrol and psi-storm
-aircraft bound to airport (no one wants to see a harrier land on clear ground)
-harrier dual missile attack without stopping in midair not possible
-animations for aircraft
-flying vehicles (NightHawk transport impossible)
-squid ship-grapple logic
-dolphin logic
-animated but standing SHPs (Dolphin, Squid would stand still)
-terror drone
-IFV
-swimming infantry
-iron curtain
-weather control (maybe with a lot of art.ini tricking, but i seriously doubt you have the knowledge to pull that off)
-spy plane SW
-badger bomber SW
-badger paratroop SW
-Spy Sat SW
-Chronosphere SW
-Gap Gen logic
-chrono legionnaire
-prism tank charge logic and laser cluster logic
-Prism tower support logic
-Aegis cruiser omnifire logic
-Destroyer osprey
-Submarines (no logic to make them shoot ships only. DTA had to sacrifice  an entire Armortype to pull this off)
-Dogs (no attack leap logic)
-Tesla effect
-Shock trooper overcharge logic
-Flak (no scatter logic for AA weapons. All shots are 100% precise in TS)
-GI, Desolator deploy (no deploy logic for infantry)
-Battlefortress (no OpenTopped logic)
-Mirage logic
-building Occupy logic
...
all YR special Yuri logics

No one would play a RA2 that is dumbed down and removed from all these.

NimoStar wrote:
However the negative people on this forum sure depress me.

Either "its stupid because its easy" or "you will never do it because its hard", both with completely out of context personal insults to merely technical assertions and questions.

You faced here over 100 years of combined modding knowledge, telling you it's a fruitless attempt and ignored it anyway.

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NimoStar
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Joined: 07 Nov 2012
Location: Buenos Aires

PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2019 12:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Quote:
Wrong, RA2 assets are not free. You would be ripping assets.
Using public remakes isn't really RA2.


What is "really" RA2? Who will judge it? There are tons of remakes with different assets including the Tencent mobile game for China with new and better assets. We have better than vainilla assets in the same style, be it CnP or 3D modelled.

So, you have no point.

Quote:
It's especially not RA2, when 80% of all special functionalities are missing and the game dumbed down to simple conventional weaponry for every unit.


Wrong again, and extremely so.

Even for mechanics that can't be recreated, there ARE tons of other special mechanics to put in their place.

Quote:
Not possible:
-V2 -Carrier->HornetLauncher-Dreadnought->DredLauncher -Yuri mindcontrol and psi-storm -aircraft bound to airport (no one wants to see a harrier land on clear ground) -harrier dual missile attack without stopping in midair not possible -animations for aircraft -flying vehicles (NightHawk transport impossible) -squid ship-grapple logic -dolphin logic -animated but standing SHPs (Dolphin, Squid would stand still) -terror drone -IFV -swimming infantry -iron curtain -weather control (maybe with a lot of art.ini tricking, but i seriously doubt you have the knowledge to pull that off) -spy plane SW -badger bomber SW -badger paratroop SW -Spy Sat SW -Chronosphere SW -Gap Gen logic -chrono legionnaire -prism tank charge logic and laser cluster logic -Prism tower support logic -Aegis cruiser omnifire logic -Destroyer osprey -Submarines (no logic to make them shoot ships only. DTA had to sacrifice  an entire Armortype to pull this off) -Dogs (no attack leap logic) -Tesla effect -Shock trooper overcharge logic -Flak (no scatter logic for AA weapons. All shots are 100% precise in TS) -GI, Desolator deploy (no deploy logic for infantry) -Battlefortress (no OpenTopped logic) -Mirage logic -building Occupy logic


Carrier-like logic already implemented in Dawn of the Tiberium Age.
Tesla effects already recreated in Dawn of the Tiberium Age.

Same for Destroyer Osprey.

Some of your "can't be done" don't even exist in RA2, AKA "Badger bomber superweapon", "Harrier two missile strikes", WTF? Harrier has a single ammo in RA2, there are no "badger superweapons", I don't know what you are smoking. Also what the hell is a "psi-storm".

Weather control is just a multi missile where the hit anim is a cloud with a lightning bolt. Boring and easy.

Prism tank attack is just a projectile with "cluster=yes" and four invoked secondary attacks. It will actually be BETTER than in RA2, as many other things.

Gap gen replaced by EMPing enemy radar.

Aegis can have a turret and opportunityfire.

Who says "nobody wants to see harriers landing on ground"? Harriers are VTOL, they can land wherever the hell they like.

Who the hell uses V2? Anyways, a conventional missile would be deserved. Notice RA3 does away with interception.

If you are picky you can make this a "deploytofire" and build V3 rockets from it.

Same for Dreadnought Missiles.

Terror Drone = Melee attack that self-heals. Will be fun.

Dog= Melee instakill only vs infantry armor

Dolphin and Squid standing still when... still = Will anyone really care?
Squid attack = Melee with Rocker=yes warhead

Nighthawk transport = This is just an aircraft with transport logic enabled

Deploy desolator and Yuri = Secondary weapon for force-firing ground

Mirage = Stealth

Battlefortress = They are cancer in multiplayer, not part of original RA2 and would have taken them out anyways.

Flak = Just use a high scatter value on the warhead

I noticed you didn't mention radiation, kirov or disk, because I already had them satisfactorily covered.

"100 years of combined modding knowledge" lol it was only you and one other guy so what? Are you modders for 50 years each?

I will let you know I made this mod with a 9.3 rating for HOMMIV https://www.moddb.com/mods/greatest-mod a game most considered "unmoddable" and there is only a single other mod in all of its history (it is almost as old as Tiberian Sun). Everyone said the same when I posted "you can't do it", "there is no way", etc. I single-handedly broke the structure of sprite ordering files from seeing the assembly HEX code and led the era that allowed other people to change the graphics.

By the way, the only reason the rate is not a perfect "10" is because Apollo entered the page just to downvote it, also posting my personal picture on the site.

This isn't the same as the H4 mod, though. My aspirations are much more modest. Just recreating approximately a game on the engine of its precursor that is 95% the same and taking advantages of missing features in the "newer" engine.

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twistedconversion
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Joined: 23 Feb 2019
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2019 12:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

NimoStar wrote:
Quote:
Wrong, RA2 assets are not free. You would be ripping assets.
Using public remakes isn't really RA2.


What is "really" RA2? Who will judge it? There are tons of remakes with different assets including the Tencent mobile game for China with new and better assets. We have better than vainilla assets in the same style, be it CnP or 3D modelled.

So, you have no point.


I'm pretty sure you angered him.

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NimoStar
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2019 1:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Im pretty sure he angered himself by criticizing that (according to himself alone) *I would not do the mod* and that I was "schizophrenic" for saying that (something that only happened in his head) and that I had "wasted everyone's time" by not doing it (even though this his first comment on the topic, aka, he would have wasted zero time)...

, then he tries for me to desist from doing it even though that's what he originally insulted me for.

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twistedconversion
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2019 1:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

NimoStar wrote:
Im pretty sure he angered himself by criticizing that (according to himself alone) *I would not do the mod* and that I was "schizophrenic" for saying that (something that only happened in his head) and that I had "wasted everyone's time" by not doing it (even though this is first comment on the topic)...

, then he tries for me to desist from doing it even though that's what he originally insulted me for.


Now you've angered him even more.

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Lin Kuei Ominae
Seth


Joined: 16 Aug 2006
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2019 1:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

NimoStar wrote:
Even for mechanics that can't be recreated, there ARE tons of other special mechanics to put in their place.

When 80% of the RA2 logics are missing, units and buildings get new images, then it's not RA2 anymore.

NimoStar wrote:
Carrier-like logic already implemented in Dawn of the Tiberium Age.

those aircraft are projectiles and can't be shot down. Balancing would need to be completely different than in RA2 -> no RA2 gameplay anymore ->no RA2 remake but a completely different game

NimoStar wrote:
Tesla effects already recreated in Dawn of the Tiberium Age.

still not good looking enough imo

NimoStar wrote:
Same for Destroyer Osprey.

wrong, no ASW logic
Osprey can't be shot down->needs rebalancing-> changes gameplay->no RA2
also no alternate VXLWO logic. Your unit would either always show an Osprey or never.

NimoStar wrote:
AKA "Badger bomber superweapon", "Harrier two missile strikes", WTF?
Harrier has a single ammo in RA2, there are no "badger superweapons", I don't know what you are smoking.

Badger bomber is the name of the plane. The plane that drops parabombs and paratroopers.



sorry, i guess i mixed up RA1 parabombs with RA2.
Well your mod would have neither of those and dumbed down to something that can't be called RA2 anymore anyways.

NimoStar wrote:
Also what the hell is a "psi-storm".

psi-storm is the deploy logic of the yuri infantry (psi-wave, psi-storm, who cares about the names)

NimoStar wrote:
Weather control is just a multi missile where the hit anim is a cloud with a lightning bolt. Boring and easy.

Wrong, in RA2 the weapon shoots multiple times over a longer duration.
Your workaround would create all clouds at the same time. You also forgot the Airburst Cluster bug, which makes 90% of the cluster missiles hit south of the target.
Yes, your workaround would be easy and thus boring. And this way completely different than in RA2.

NimoStar wrote:
Prism tank attack is just a projectile with "cluster=yes" and four invoked secondary attacks. It will actually be BETTER than in RA2, as many other things.

wrong, no laser cluster possible. graphics would suck. nowhere close to RA2
No clue what you mean with "invoked secondary attacks".

Not one of your workarounds would be better than the original.

NimoStar wrote:
Gap gen replaced by EMPing enemy radar.

wrong, GAP creates shroud and makes targeting under it hard/impossible.
This is a completely different gameplay mechanic than simply shutting down enemy radar, which most players don't use/care in the first place, since radar is tiny and useless.
There is no logic in TS to target a radar only with an EMP weapon.
You have no clue what you're talking about.

NimoStar wrote:
Aegis can have a turret and opportunityfire.

No OpportunityFire logic in TS. You have again no clue what you're up to.

NimoStar wrote:
Who says "nobody wants to see harriers landing on ground"? Harriers are VTOL, they can land wherever the hell they like.

Destroying airforce commands to this way let enemy planes crash is a tactic in RA2, but not possible in TS. You change gameplay again->Not RA2.

NimoStar wrote:
Who the hell uses V2? Anyways, a conventional missile would be deserved. Notice RA3 does away with interception.

yes, the most important artillery unit in RA2, who cares if it works completely different now. different gamplay->Not RA2.
You talk about RA2 remake, not RA3.

NimoStar wrote:
If you are picky you can make this a "deploytofire" and build V3 rockets from it.

What?
So i deploy 6 of them, then build 500 rockets in my base and launch them all at the same time to kill any enemy across the entire map? (there is no Rangelimiting for build Aircraft)
Completely ridiculous and not possible to balance. You have no clue what you're doing.

NimoStar wrote:
Same for Dreadnought Missiles.

wrong, you have no clue.
you would need to drastically rebalance the unit and this way change gameplay->Not RA2

NimoStar wrote:
Terror Drone = Melee attack that self-heals. Will be fun.

wrong, there is no melee attack in TS. Range=2 would cause a 1 cell gap, Range=1.5 has problems to shoot at diagonal cells and create pathfinding issues.
Attacks that self-heal? Nice, so the player can just force fire on ground to heal it for free.
Terror Drones would be also vulnerable all the time.
->completely different gameplay->Not RA2
you have no clue what you're doing

NimoStar wrote:
Dog= Melee instakill only vs infantry armor

And you have only 1 armortype while RA2 used 3 for the different infantries. ->again gameplay changes necessary which make this in no way similar to RA2.
Melee attacks impossible. As described above, you need at least Range=2, for infantry even Range=2.5 to reach all 3 inner cell infantry places for all adjacent cells. Thus your Dog would kill from very far away, this would visually suck.
You have no clue what you're up to.

NimoStar wrote:
Dolphin and Squid standing still when... still = Will anyone really care?
Squid attack = Melee with Rocker=yes warhead

graphics would suck in your mod then.
again melee. Though squid is big and Range=2 might be acceptable here. Pathfinding for the squid would suck anyway.

NimoStar wrote:
Nighthawk transport = This is just an aircraft with transport logic enabled

without a weapon then, build from a different building, without rotors and just a metallic box in midair.
oh wow, what a fun your "RA2" mod will be.

NimoStar wrote:
Deploy desolator and Yuri = Secondary weapon for force-firing ground

I doubt you know the workaround necessary to make a weapon work against ground only.(it's not only adjusting the Verses)
Even if you pull that off, forcefiring isn't really a convenient way for the player to use that.
In addition would the unit use the normal firing anim -> the graphics would suck-> no RA2

NimoStar wrote:
Mirage = Stealth

wrong, you need stealth already for submarines.
As a player being able to simply hover the mouse over trees and shot on any tree that changes the mouse cursor to an attack cursor is also different than invisible units suddenly appearing.
btw, no colored alphalight in TS. Your mirage weapon impact glow anim would not be comparable to RA2 and surely look much worse.

NimoStar wrote:
Flak = Just use a high scatter value on the warhead

Wrong. Read what i wrote. There is no FlakScatter for AA weapons in TS.
If you think about using Inaccurate=yes, well that works for AG weapons only.
Oh and all AA weapons also damage objects on the ground right below the impact and you don't have enough armortypes to make them damage aircraft only.

NimoStar wrote:
I noticed you didn't mention radiation, kirov or disk, because I already had them satisfactorily covered.

sorry, i couldn't remember everything from a game i last played 15 years ago.
I seriously doubt your solution is satisfactorily though. Your radiation would most likely cause massive lag in online gaming or work so different, that it can't be called radiation.

NimoStar wrote:
"100 years of combined modding knowledge" lol it was only you and one other guy so what? Are you modders for 50 years each?

i guess you check again who posted here (E1, GD, Apollo, OmegaBolt, Rampa), it wasn't only me and one other guy.

NimoStar wrote:
I will let you know I made this mod with a 9.3 rating for HOMMIV https://www.moddb.com/mods/greatest-mod a game most considered "unmoddable" and there is only a single other mod in all of its history (it is almost as old as Tiberian Sun). Everyone said the same when I posted "you can't do it", "there is no way", etc. I single-handedly broke the structure of sprite ordering files from seeing the assembly HEX code and led the era that allowed other people to change the graphics.

nice for you, though i don't care, because this has nothing to do with this topic and your lack of knowledge of the TS engine.

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NimoStar
Commander


Joined: 07 Nov 2012
Location: Buenos Aires

PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2019 1:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Quote:
There is no logic in TS to target a radar only with an EMP weapon.
You have no clue what you're doing.


You have no clue of what am I capable of doing.

As an example:

Set special armor for Radar, make SW that damages only radar armor, make SW warhead deal EMP damage (already exists in EMP pulse), set AI targeting to center of enemy base, etc. etc. the rest is history.

Gap generator as it is in RA2 makes no sense in TS - The enemy already can't see your base or units, because of Fog of War.

(Another stupid RA2 limitation, there is only shroud, no fog - TS wrecks this to pieces)



Quote:
When 80% of the RA2 logics are missing, units and buildings get new images, then it's not RA2 anymore.


"logics" =/= gameplay, look and feel, etc; logics can be replaced.

"units and buildings get new images"
So I guess your image is not a Mammoth MK2 just because its a custom made asset? and "it is not tiberian sun"? Lol

Come on.
All mods do this.
Is this a modding forum, or what?

Saying that it would be a "compoletely different game" because carrier aircraft can't be shot down? Lol
Then every mod that changes a single value in the rules.ini is a "completely different game".

I guess even CnCnet is a "completely different game" because of the balance changes in TS and RA2.

OpenRA is not really Red Alert but a "completely different game" due to their balance and faction changes and missing logics...

ETC. ETC. ETC.

Some stupid nitpicking about not showing an osprey, lol...

Stupid "objections" about attacking the ground to heal when you can just set the unit to not attack ground.

Melee attacks can be simulated with anims with range =2.
Infantry don't occupy whole tiles either way, there will be no "gap", my terror drone would be infantry.

There are no parabombs in RA2.
Paratroopers can be made with TS Pod logic.

But then... "PODS CAN'T BE SHOT DOWN HAHA COMPLETELY DIFFERENT GAME GG OWNED"

Quote:
i guess you check again who posted here (E1, GD, Apollo, OmegaBolt, Rampa), it wasn't only me and one other guy.


Mig Eater = Didn't say anything about not doing it

E1 Elite = Didn't say anything about not doing it

Graion Dilach = Only spoke of openRA and didn't insult me here, for a change

^Rampastein = Only answered a question about if I could have extra factions with their own MCVs (yes)

Only one that "applies" sort of:
OmegaBolt = Didn't say anything about not doing it, warned about missing features "downgrade", says he preferred RA2 engine

ApolloTD = Stupidly said this was an "easy" and "small" project for people with no "mod skills", so he said 100% the opposite as you.

Quote:
I doubt you know the workaround necessary to make a weapon work against ground only.(it's not only adjusting the Verses)
Even if you pull that off, forcefiring isn't really a convenient way for the player to use that.
In addition would the unit use the normal firing anim -> the graphics would suck-> no RA2


I doubt you have a brain and I have already done most these things in RA2 including recreating RA3 mechanics like Flea Jump, Tesla Trooper RA3 deploy, conscript molotovs, Athena cannon with proper targeting delay and shield, and so on.

Firing anim = make a firing anim that is the anim of the unit deploying with some glow behind to obscure the original.

Force firing is more practical for mouse than deploying.

I doubt you have brains.

The goal was never to make something "exactly the same". I said so myself. If not, *to take advantage of TS engine exclusive features would be a non-issue*


PS: You act as an expert on RA2 and its "Playability" even though you don't even know basic things like the harrier having a single attack lol
"a game you haven't played on 15 years" and you only make TS assets and hate on RA2 on numerous occasions...

Yet you suddenly "want to preotect the precious ra2 mechanics". Invent a better excuse.

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Lin Kuei Ominae
Seth


Joined: 16 Aug 2006
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2019 2:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

NimoStar wrote:
Set special armor for Radar, make SW that damages only radar armor, make SW warhead deal EMP damage (already exists in EMP pulse), set AI targeting to center of enemy base, etc. etc. the rest is history.

you have only 5 armor types.
submarines-one armor
ships-another armor
radar-another armor
infantry-another armor
Do you plan to give tanks, buildings, aircraft all the same armor?
As written above, no player cares about the radar. Your SW would be the most useless SW ever.

NimoStar wrote:

Gap generator as it is in RA2 makes no sense in TS - The enemy already can't see your base or units, because of Fog of War.

(Another stupid RA2 limitation, there is only shroud, no fog - TS wrecks this to pieces)

you obviously forgot, that FoW in TS is bugged and causes random crashes.
Regrowing shroud is possible, but no player would like that.


About the other stuff you wrote.
You said you want to make a RA2 remake. Players expect certain logics and gameplay from RA2.

NimoStar wrote:
Stupid "objections" about attacking the ground to heal when you can just set the unit to not attack ground.

no such logic exists. when a unit has a weapon it can be force fired on ground too.

NimoStar wrote:
Melee attacks can be simulated with anims with range =2.
Infantry don't occupy whole tiles either way, there will be no "gap", my terror drone would be infantry.

2 diagonal adjacent cells, with your drone on the far right inner cell location and the target on the far left inner cell location would not look like melee attacks. There is a visual gap big enough for a MMKII to fit in between the 2 units.

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NimoStar
Commander


Joined: 07 Nov 2012
Location: Buenos Aires

PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2019 2:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Quote:
you have only 5 armor types.
submarines-one armor
ships-another armor
radar-another armor
infantry-another armor
Do you plan to give tanks, buildings, aircraft all the same armor?
As written above, no player cares about the radar. Your SW would be the most useless SW ever.


I never said submarines and ships would have each special armors. I have other ways to take care of that.

The "gap generator" this covers *is already nearly completely useless* in TS logic because of fog of war. In other words every polayer plays as if they had a "gap generator".

This was just an example of how things you say "cannot be done" actually can be done.

But when I show you how you just yell: "YOU DONE EXACTLY WHAT YOU SAID YOU WOULD DO BUT I STILL DON'T LIKE IT!!!21112"

So why even bother? I won't even read the rest.

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twistedconversion
Rocket Infantry


Joined: 23 Feb 2019
Location: Egypt

PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2019 2:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

NimoStar wrote:
I won't even read the rest.


Face palm!

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ImP_RuLz
Jumpjet Infantry


Joined: 21 May 2004
Location: Pakistan

PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2019 12:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

if you're going to change all those things then its not a remake, its just another mod for TS

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Noddy
Vehicle Driver


Joined: 24 Oct 2017

PostPosted: Sun Apr 14, 2019 12:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I'm not gonna lie this thread is worth to read through. This amount of stupidity and arrogance can't be seen everyday.

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d143b2
Civilian


Joined: 03 Jun 2013

PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 5:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

putting allied and soviets in TS isn't RA2. TS, FS, RA2 and YR using the same game engine, bits of things are missing in each game.

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