Joined: 01 Mar 2007 Location: Dead and back Commander...Dead and back
Posted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 5:08 am Post subject:
What Lightstorm has been doing
basically, I've been playing CoH, eve, and having a pretty busy real life, but I figured with the release of C&C4 only a few months away, I'd stop back here with a wave and an idea, an idea that, hopefully some people will agree with.
The idea is thus: Company of Heroes is epic, and amazing, easily the best rts out there right now, the gameplay is so perfectly balanced, the sides play so uniquely, and the battles are so epic, they easily put all the command and conquer games to shame, simply by regard to how tactical and microy the gameplay is, you care about every one of your units and take good care of them, the combat is intense and the graphics are beautiful. I can't even describe all the things that make it a great rts, but its exceeded my expectations on every front, and I'm finding myself hard pressed to find a game of equal quality, even Universe at War, which I loved to death can't hold a candle to CoH.
and I remembered Command and Conquer. I went back and replayed the campaign, but the combat system was just so shallow compared to CoH, the delicate layers upon layers of tactics and micromanagement and cover were stomped all over by tank rushes and venom spams. gameplay wise, command and conquer is just not as good.
but it could be.
What if, using CoH as a base game, and borrowing units from Tiberium wars, a new command and conquer game was created, a total modification of CoH, that turned it into TW, but at the same time, did not, retaining the delicate progression of tactics and balance between the two sides.
Imagine, fighting house to house with infantry firing out of buildings, slowly working your way through the streets, block by bloody block, only to hear a crash as an Avatar rises out of its crouched position to tower three stories into the air, raining fire and death down onto the battlefield.
It would be excellent.
New textures would be needed since the C&C units are much smaller and less detailed then their CoH counterparts, but the models themselves could be pulled out wholesale, along with the dialog, large sections of the HUD, and other bits. The more I think about it, the more excellent and awesome I think it would be.
I've been planning it all out, GDI would be heavily upgrade based, with units that start okay, but get their power from being upgraded with enhancements and purchasing better equipment, while Nod would base on overall upgrades.
I'm still debating how the resource system would work, cause the CoH system works decently, and it would seriously gimp balance to just dump tiberium in wholesale, probably the best way to do it would be to have tiberium as one of the three resources (replace munitions or fuel with it) and have it acquired by capping victory points like the current system in CoH. But anyway, less me blabbing, more actually happening, anyone find this idea interesting? _________________ Join My forum (please??)
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there appears to be a decent amount of software out there to allow editing of units and basic level game code, and since we'd be using a lot of the units straight out of tiberium wars, you'd probably be able to import models and code wholesale, It'd simply be a matter of compare riflemen code to rifle squad code, and using that as a baseline, do the code for the militia squads.
The subfactions from Kane's wrath could also evolve into the doctrines and branches used in CoH.
Honestly, most of the elements in C&C3 are already in CoH, I mean, unit stealth vs stealth detection, support powers, flame weapons, etc etc, it would be a lot of work yes, but in terms of difficultly, it would probably actually rate easier then a standard total conversion mod for C&C3.
also, big reveal of irl, check the tibweb boards. _________________ Join My forum (please??)
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Joined: 01 Mar 2007 Location: Dead and back Commander...Dead and back
Posted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 3:33 pm Post subject:
if people are really interested in this, we can look at getting a design team together and starting work.
I can't really model or texture, but I can code and balance, I'll have to read up on CoH unit and object code, but if you've seen one game code, you've seen them all.
If the interest is there, we could see about getting a forum set up to discuss design and get a team built.
this is actually really exciting and has much potential for epic win. _________________ Join My forum (please??)
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CoH Players never saw the dark side of relic, Dawn of War was a shambles. Reric make bug.
I don't get what you mean...
Relic made great RTSes: Homeworld, Homeworld: Cataclysm, Homeworld 2, Dawn of War, Company of Heroes.
Quote:
and I remembered Command and Conquer. I went back and replayed the campaign, but the combat system was just so shallow compared to CoH, the delicate layers upon layers of tactics and micromanagement and cover were stomped all over by tank rushes and venom spams. gameplay wise, command and conquer is just not as good.
You started playing the wrong C&C game!
CoH does have many things C&C has but afaik CoH doesn't support controllable flying units.
But the idea sounds interesting and afaik PPM isn't a C&C only site you can even see some archived WarCraft and StarCraft mods laying around in the PPM forums.
And uhh nice to have you back Lightstorm! _________________ QUICK_EDIT
Joined: 18 Feb 2005 Location: Star Kingdom of Manticore
Posted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 8:50 pm Post subject:
Lightstorm wrote:
if people are really interested in this, we can look at getting a design team together and starting work.
I can't really model or texture, but I can code and balance, I'll have to read up on CoH unit and object code, but if you've seen one game code, you've seen them all.
If the interest is there, we could see about getting a forum set up to discuss design and get a team built.
this is actually really exciting and has much potential for epic win.
I can model. Not really good at texturing, but I can model. If you're willing to wait until i get back stateside, that is. I'll be in Iraq for two more months, then I'll be home free. Right now though, i'm kinda paused on the whole mod world because I am tasked with the logistics of the entire battalion's move back home. _________________ "Reality is a lovely place, but I wouldn't want to live there." -Adam Young QUICK_EDIT
Yes CoH is amazing, I play it all the time, and no doubt like you said the best RTS out there.
However it is very difficult to mod CoH. Much more difficult compared to CnC games at least. Its not as simple as code this, clone that. _________________
Retired YR Player
Steam Account : MAS93
Xfire: msbiohazard QUICK_EDIT
Joined: 01 Mar 2007 Location: Dead and back Commander...Dead and back
Posted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 9:57 pm Post subject:
Biohazard wrote:
Yes CoH is amazing, I play it all the time, and no doubt like you said the best RTS out there.
However it is very difficult to mod CoH. Much more difficult compared to CnC games at least. Its not as simple as code this, clone that.
can you give me a heads up on some of the pitflls involved in it, like, what makes it difficult?
Also, I'm pretty sure there are ways to do just about everything in C&C using the CoH engine, which seems rather powerful, there are all kinds of state changes, weapon upgrades, and other fun stuff.
As for controllable air units, I think there might actually be ways to get those out of the code, they'd be hard to use though, firehawks would fly too high to be useable, and would very likely need to be npc controllled simply by virtue of that, but an Orca scrapping rooftops and releasing a volley of missiles and bullets onto the streets below might be possible.
But like I said, I haven't seen the code for CoH yet, I'm gonna reg on a coh modding forum later today and see about getting some basics, how to extract, what c&c coder should expect, what system the code uses, etc. _________________ Join My forum (please??)
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Joined: 03 Dec 2008 Location: Your Mum Dragons: Lame
Posted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 10:39 pm Post subject:
Tore wrote:
I don't get what you mean...
Relic made great RTSes: Homeworld, Homeworld: Cataclysm, Homeworld 2, Dawn of War, Company of Heroes.
When Soulstorm was released it came with some massive bugs/exploits, the community was told they were getting a 'hotfix' about 5 months after the release stated as early July, the patch actually came around December. Constantly kept in the dark about stuff as well, they really didn't care it seemed - still bugged to this day afaik with horrid balance (9 races are difficult to balance mind) _________________ DIAB: Dragons are lame.
I looked into modding CoH not too long ago. The tool-sets and such aren't' very user friendly, and AFAIK their is no GUI editing at all. Also, collectible resources aren't implementable. _________________ You come for the modding but you stay for the Crap Forum. QUICK_EDIT
Thats one, and its pretty difficult to learn, all the different type of models that are going to be needed (such as Main weapon destroyed on tanks, Immobolized, Engine destroyed and Tank Ruins etc.) Theres many more.
Im not try to say "no dont do it!" Hell I would prefer cnc3/kw on the CoH engine. Better possibilites. Im just making sure everyone knows if this mod is to proceed its going to require extreme dedication. For its pretty tricky stuff. _________________
Retired YR Player
Steam Account : MAS93
Xfire: msbiohazard QUICK_EDIT
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What Lightstorm has been doing
Not really good at texturing, but I can model. If you're willing to wait until i get back stateside, that is. I'll be in Iraq for two more months, then I'll be home free. Right now though, i'm kinda paused on the whole mod world because I am tasked with the logistics of the entire battalion's move back home.
