Joined: 03 Nov 2007 Location: laptop? ... otherwise the Czech Republic -> south Moravia Posts: long int Posts;
Posted: Sat Feb 14, 2009 1:56 am Post subject:
PC x notebook
Subject description: What's your opinion? What do you prefer (pool)?
ORCACommander wrote:
Quote:
Todays PC's beat laptops hands down. Only thing laptops have for them is portability.
portability, lower wattage, low danger of loose of your datas during blackout if you aren't using UPC (even when I compare those rare (regrettably no lot manufacture unlike with A5 book sized) micro pocket PCs with netbooks), silent run (off-course normal PC can have this too)
I don't know what you mean with that beat... the line between PCs and laptops is thinner and thinner, the electricity is more and more expensive (+16% rise in price after January is pretty much), EU bans production of every electric heating unless it's primary function of that product (this happened to light bulb).
I have Asus M51SN which costed 1080 € in August 2008.
Intel Core 2 Duo T8300 2.4 GHz, 15,4" WXGA+ ColorShine 1440x900 (middle HD), DVD Sup. MTI (lightscribe), wi-fi, 250 GB HDD, 4GB RAM, NVIDIA Geforce 9500M GS 512MB + 1280 MB in TurboCache, 3 USB 2.0, few other connectors,
off-course includes wi-fi, bluetooth, combo card reader, numerical keyboard and hybrid TV tuner (mouse, bag, remote control (of the Windows Media) Center and digi antenna were in pack). Windows Vista 32 bit was there installed (I will upgrade on Win 7 if this will be really free). I haven't played CoD4 or Crysis, but I know every RTS works on the biggest details on this machine (TW:KW and RA3 do).
Similar PC (HP is expensive, such thinks deform price):
LCD - around 130 € (10W speakers included), keyboard 20 €,
similar PC itself 666 € (with 350 W source (!)), etc.
Total: 816 € +- 200 €
Difference is around 250 € which is caused by battery (130 €), some extra things, low-wattage and more resistent components (although desktop case is more solid than case of notebook), some notebooks can resist submersion, stamping or fall from height (however the most extreme notebooks aren't very efficient, but partially these features are more or less getting to normal notebooks).
Off-course if you are student on the University in some economically and culturally advanced country, you need notebook, however you can buy some older notebook or netbook (new costs some 200 €) as supplement to the desktop PC.
But when you compare wattage of normal PC and notebook, you can get these numbers:
PC: 120–430 W in average
notebook: 28 W - 80 W in average
netbook x office desktop PC: 6-15 W x (20W - 100 W)
(PC with same age and with same LCD <35W> 146.4 kWh)
PC: 200 Wh * 8 * 365.25 = 730 500 Wh (yeah, five more)
with sleep mode (!) : 730 500 Wh + 11 * 8 * 365.25 = 762642 Wh (5.2*more)
The result: Placed [b]money returns after 1.5 years[\b], so if you use your notebook for 3 years, you have 250 € more than for similar PC!
BTW, I haven't mention Barbone (and other minimalistic) systems which are similar to laptops, similar Barbone source would consume some 120W, Barbone = 80 €.
Also big speakers consume pretty much electricity, stand-by appliances consumes some energy, too (well, router/switch consumes 1-10W, non-stop).
PC is one of 3 most electricity consuming appliances, other 2 are TV and lights (light bulbs, halogen bulbs or fluorescent tube). To save your money buy notebook PC (or Barbone) instead of normal PC, compact fluorescent tubes where you light for longer time (it's disccutable to use them on WC or in the bathroom + sometimes it's better to use normal light bulbs - f. example to read a book), don't forget switching them off, buy LCD instead of old CRT TV (or Plasma TV if you need better response and colour, but shorter life or higher electricity consumption doesn't matter), don't waste, it's not so hard... _________________
Don't blame the others if you haven't checked your own (in)ability in the first case. QUICK_EDIT
Joined: 03 Nov 2007 Location: laptop? ... otherwise the Czech Republic -> south Moravia Posts: long int Posts;
Posted: Sat Feb 14, 2009 2:35 am Post subject:
Forgot to vote
I voted multimedial notebook, because I need his mobility and complexity, too. (and playing RA3 in school house or watching TV is also good)
BTW, good night. ...erm morning. :p _________________
Don't blame the others if you haven't checked your own (in)ability in the first case. QUICK_EDIT
The PC will always win (in the area of perfermance) by pure virture that it's larger and can holder larger-and therefore more complex parts. The latest and greatest video cards are half the size of some laptops. Screens can be bigger (and even dual monitor setups). You never have to worry about batteries. Of course, usability depends on the user. But then you must decide what is worthy of sarcificing to gain mobility. _________________ Please, read the signature rules of the forum. QUICK_EDIT
Joined: 16 Feb 2005 Location: North America Posts: You cannot comprehend...
Posted: Sat Feb 14, 2009 3:29 am Post subject:
DaFool wrote:
The PC will always win (in the area of perfermance) by pure virture that it's larger and can holder larger-and therefore more complex parts. The latest and greatest video cards are half the size of some laptops. Screens can be bigger (and even dual monitor setups). You never have to worry about batteries. Of course, usability depends on the user. But then you must decide what is worthy of sarcificing to gain mobility.
Quoted for truth. _________________ Destroy to create. All for the hunt to dominate!
Joined: 14 Feb 2006 Location: Flying into hostile territory
Posted: Sat Feb 14, 2009 2:55 pm Post subject:
also laptops run hot which reduceds their lifetime vs a pc. also if you custom built a pc going through newegg/similar to newegg, or a local company can greatly reduce the price. laptops you can not build from scratch all that much anda are a lot less modular. My computer if I did not already have monitor keyboard and mouse would have cost me maybe 50+100 dollars more than your laptop. if this came from a big name manufacturer it would be at least $1,500 USD _________________ QUICK_EDIT
Joined: 03 Nov 2007 Location: laptop? ... otherwise the Czech Republic -> south Moravia Posts: long int Posts;
Posted: Sun Feb 15, 2009 3:46 pm Post subject:
Well, some shops are expensive and some companies make expensive PCs. It's fact, when you buy every component and then compound, you can save pretty much money when this isn't possible with notebook, other thing is you have to watch many details.
I have still functionable desktop PC (compounded by dad's known) with the age of 10 years (Celeron 333MHz, 196 MB RAM, some 16 MB gfx card, 20 GB HDD, CRT, mouse with ball (netbook with price of some 200 € is more efficient)), but my parents have desktop PC (replaced the old one) with age of 3 years (Fujitsu-Siemens, with 19" LCD, mouse and keyboard 1050 €), but when we had it 2 years, AMD Athlon 3000+ crashed and upgrade (240 €) was needed, monitor, case, source and HDD are OK, keyboard has been replaced and mouse needs repair of the cable. With new source the HDD would be larger.
Laptop consumes 3-5 times less energy than similar desktop, but as you said it's less modular, I don't know if it's possible to replace motherboard without big interference breaking the guarantee, I think I should be able to replace graphic card, I am sure I should be able to replace HDD or display (it's not like buying new monitor, but it's possible). When someone comes with fully modular laptop (s)he will gain big money. I need laptop because of school, so mobility is very important to me.
Also it's possible laptop's components work on higher temperature than normal PC, but I don't know, the ventilator runs all the time... _________________
Don't blame the others if you haven't checked your own (in)ability in the first case. QUICK_EDIT
Joined: 28 Sep 2005 Location: Mixing psilocybin in your drinks.
Posted: Mon Feb 16, 2009 4:10 am Post subject:
I get really picky about this stuff, so I'm just gonna address what pops out at me because I'll be up all night with every single point if I'm not selective.
partyzanPaulZy wrote:
(I will upgrade on Win 7 if this will be really free).
It won't be, as far as I know. The transition process is simply easier than with XP because you keep all your settings, programs, games, and drivers.
partyzanPaulZy wrote:
Similar PC (HP is expensive, such thinks deform price):
LCD - around 130 € (10W speakers included), keyboard 20 €,
similar PC itself 666 € (with 350 W source (!)), etc.
Total: 816 € +- 200 €
You can shave a good 100-200 euro off of brand-name pre-built stuff by doing it yourself with off-the-shelf parts. It's really not good for demonstrating a point to use what you did as a reference point. Paying that much gets you a LOT more of a CPU and GPU for your money than a laptop; ESPECIALLY the graphics where a decent graphics chip capable of playing new games at what should be at least medium detail levels will bump the cost of a laptop to over 1500 dollars.
partyzanPaulZy wrote:
low-wattage and more resistent components (although desktop case is more solid than case of notebook), some notebooks can resist submersion, stamping or fall from height (however the most extreme notebooks aren't very efficient, but partially these features are more or less getting to normal notebooks).
The components in a laptop, aside from the hard drives, aren't necessarily more rugged or well-built. The enclosure around the components is simply designed to absorb all the shock of an impact so the circuit boards aren't cracked/broken.
partyzanPaulZy wrote:
Off-course if you are student on the University in some economically and culturally advanced country, you need notebook, however you can buy some older notebook or netbook (new costs some 200 €) as supplement to the desktop PC.
Which is what I'd prefer to do.
partyzanPaulZy wrote:
The result: Placed [b]money returns after 1.5 years[\b], so if you use your notebook for 3 years, you have 250 € more than for similar PC!
It is quite true that laptops use less energy than desktops, but that's only because they need less. A computer only uses as much energy as it has to, plus the difference in efficiency in the power supply. Given that laptops are designed to be portable, they need small parts, which use substantially less energy. Desktops can have whatever you want and are much more customizable, so that creates a proportionate level of power draw. It's sort of the price to pay for the amount of power you get for the initial cost, but it is worth it.
partyzanPaulZy wrote:
Also big speakers consume pretty much electricity, stand-by appliances consumes some energy, too (well, router/switch consumes 1-10W, non-stop).
This is unavoidable and just something you have to deal with.
partyzanPaulZy wrote:
To save your money buy notebook PC (or Barbone) instead of normal PC,
If you play a lot of demanding games, then just upgrade the power supply in your current system to something with at least an 80 Plus Bronze rating. This ensures you're not using a whole lot more than you need to. Or, to go one step further, you could build a portable desktop inside something like this and just slap a pair of handles on it and you can fit all your normal desktop equipment in but have portability.
partyzanPaulZy wrote:
compact fluorescent tubes where you light for longer time (it's disccutable to use them on WC or in the bathroom + sometimes it's better to use normal light bulbs - f. example to read a book), don't forget switching them off,
Compact fluorescent lights have come a long way and you can get them in any style you want. LED lights are now gaining ground little by little as well, but until they start putting prisms and mirrors and whatnot inside the housings, LEDs remain more practical in directional applications, like flashlights.
partyzanPaulZy wrote:
buy LCD instead of old CRT TV (or Plasma TV if you need better response and colour, but shorter life or higher electricity consumption doesn't matter), don't waste, it's not so hard...
This I support.
ORCACommander wrote:
also laptops run hot which reduceds their lifetime vs a pc.
Your idea of a hot laptop needs to change, Ben. Modern laptops are very cool if, and this is a big if, they're designed properly. Lifetime in a laptop is not affected by the heat created by its own internals nearly as much as you seem to think.
partyzanPaulZy wrote:
I think I should be able to replace graphic card,
If it's on an MXM module, yes. You just have to know where to look for new ones.
partyzanPaulZy wrote:
Also it's possible laptop's components work on higher temperature than normal PC, but I don't know, the ventilator runs all the time...
That really depends on what's in the system. Older parts are hotter and less efficient, thus require more extravagant cooling. New laptops are actually quite cool; would you rather feel all that hot air being blown out of the laptop case (and there shouldn't be that much from the new ones unless you play a lot of games or do a lot of rendering, which IMO should be left to the desktops), or having it trapped around the components and killing the system? _________________
[quote="DCoder"]There is no sanity left in this thread.[/quote] QUICK_EDIT
Also Known As: evanb90 Joined: 20 Feb 2005 Location: o kawaii koto
Posted: Mon Feb 16, 2009 4:24 am Post subject:
partyzan, I have almost the exact same laptop as you, except my max-res is 1280x800..
Can't say much else about it, however. I don't want to move as it may risk moving the screen from its current position.
I got a defective LCD, with a red line running down the screen vertically, and it just so happens that when I took it back from a class recently, the line had disappeared...
Now I just got to find a good time to send this thing in for repairs...
(personally, besides this little LCD defect, I am more than happy with this laptop, and have enjoyed using it vastly more than any desktop pc) _________________ YR modder/artist, DOOM mapper, aka evanb90
Project Lead Developer, New-Star Strike (2014-)
Former Project Lead DeveloperStar Strike (2005-2012), Z-Mod (2006-2007), RA1.5 (2008-2013), The Cold War (2006-2007) QUICK_EDIT
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PC x notebook
