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Starcraft Vs Warcraft Vs Red Alert (2)
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ConMan
Tiberian Beast


Joined: 16 Dec 2008
Location: Toronto, Canada

PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 4:33 pm    Post subject:  Starcraft Vs Warcraft Vs Red Alert (2)
Subject description: You might have read this before
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The original site is here, but I don't recommend clicking it since my mozilla reported it as an attack site Shocked

"You can practice warcraft for two months and learn all the skills
You can practice starcraft for two years and still haven’t mastered the basics
You can practice red alert for two days and still be as good as when you began playing

When you can beat two computers in warcraft, you can start winning in multi-player
When you can beat seven computers in starcraft, you still can't win in muliplayer
When you beat a computer for the eight millionth time you realize you never played online

Play warcraft for two hours and you can lose to the same strategy 8 times in a row, suffering a crushing defeat
Play starcraft for two hours and you can lose to 16 different strategies 8 times in a rows, suffering a crushing defeat
Play red alert for two years and you lose to the exact same thing forever, suffering a crushing defeat

Play warcraft you only have to practice one race to learn all the match ups of that race
Play starcraft and you will realize, 3 years later, a Zerg exterminator used to be good with the zerg
Play red alert and you only need to practice on one nation to learn every other nation

Learn a few strategies from warcraft and you can start winning
Master fifty strategies from starcraft and you still can't start winning
Learn a few strategies from red alert and they’re all useless. Just stick to the one everyone uses--forever

A noob's day in warcraft: You cornered your enemy but they still manage to get out in one piece
A noob's day in starcraft: You realize apart from guerrilla warfare there is also ground pushes, ambushes, harass, sieges, nuking, faking, etc.
A noob’s day in red alert: You realize strategies are pointless—mass mass mass!

In warcraft no matter how far you're from your base you can still return and save it in ten seconds (telepor)
In starcraft your army can be in the east side of your base and yet your west portion still gets wiped out.
In red alert, pay attention to your ore miners

In warcraft you scout once every 5 minutes and know what your opponent's army consists of.
In starcraft you scout 5 times every minute and still get false intelligence.
In red alert you scout for the first 5 minutes and there will be no need to do so anymore

In warcraft you can still guess what your opponent's army is made out of even if you don't scout for 5 minutes.
In starcraft your opponent's army will be made out stuff that completely counter yours if you don't scout for 3 minutes.
In red alert you don’t scout.

In warcraft you can relax if you win a big battle
In starcraft you can win a big battle and still get caught by a drop, losing your base completely
In red alert you won a big battle and you feel good—it’s just the normal routine.

In warcraft big battles are often one sided in body count.
In starcraft big battles are often two sided in body count.
In red alert, dead people disappear.

In warcraft your army gets wiped out and you’re basically dead meat
In starcraft your army gets wiped out 10 times and the victor is still uncertain.
In red alert your army gets wiped out and it’s just everyday life—come back in 10 seconds

In warcraft you can watch half the replay and tell who's going to win
In starcraft you realize your prediction on the victor is wrong towards the last minute
In red alert you don’t know what a replay is, nor do you know about live games

In warcraft if your main base gets wiped out you're dead meat
In starcraft your main base, your expo gets wiped out and yet you and your opponent have already traded bases, or you have your Command Centers floating everywhere.
In red alert you base can be blown up, as well as captured, stolen, sabotaged, and even packed up to leave the spot

In warcraft the game is set when all the resources are drained
In starcraft you drain every last drop of resource and still get a draw

In warcraft you can hold back, turtle and wait for your chance to come.
In starcraft if you hold back, turtle, you'll find out that every expansion is taken by your opponent with their workers working in it.
In red alert you only fight for resource, that’s the way it is

In warcraft you build a shit load of defense at your front door and your opponent will tell you off for being cheap
In starcraft you build a shit load of defense at your front door and your opponent either drop you or nuke you
In red alert you build a shit load of defense at your front door, the back door and the interior of your base, and then you tell off your opponent for copying your base pattern.

In warcraft you can use bully lower level units with higher level ones
In starcraft you can use marines to counter carriers...

In warcraft you'll have to run when you see enemy air units and if you have no anti-air
In starcraft you attack with a muta rush and your base can get wiped out by 3 groups of zerglings.

In warcraft you sometimes doubt that quantity makes up for quality
In starcraft you never doubt that quantity makes up for quality

In warcraft your heart will break every time you lose a unit
In starcraft you'll know what a horde is like
In red alert a unit is made to die

In warcraft you don't separate your troops
In starcraft small scale battles are all over the map
In red alert the battle fields are all mutually agreed — where ore miners meet!

In warcraft you fight changes
In starcraft you change to fight
In red alerts there’s no such thing as ‘change’

In warcraft you're proud of your hero that's one level higher than your opponent's
In starcraft you're proud of your zealot that blew up 10 siege tanks by sacrificing itself to the spider mine field and tank fire.
In red alert you’re proud of your air unit that secured the resource node

In warcraft when your APM is over 150 you'll get bored that you start setting rally points
In starcraft when your APM is over 150 you'll be able to execute the most basic commands
In red alert when your APM is over 150 you’re out of your mind. APM does not exist in red alert

In warcraft you're excited when you micro 12 individual units
In starcraft carpet bombardment with 12 dropships on 12 different screens is still basic(maybe not...)
In red alert placing a building is microing

In warcraft even meteors can recognize friends and foes
In starcraft a careless psi storm will be more catastrophic to you than your opponent
In red alert your units can force attack to kill each other

In warcraft you always say ‘that’s logical'
In starcraft you always say ‘that's possible’
In red alert you always say ‘that’s impossible’

In warcraft you'll learn what efficiency is
In starcraft you'll learn what quantity is
In red alert you’ll learn what ranking is

In warcraft you'll learn the importance of level ups
In starcraft you'll learn the importance of economy
In red alert you’ll learn the importance of a huge army

In warcraft you learn how to battle
In starcraft you learn how to wage war
In red alert you learn how to follow the instruction booklet

In warcraft all maps are land based up till now
In starcraft there're island maps ever since WCG2001
In red alert you realize the map never changes

In warcraft you'll find out that there're a couple completely useless units in the game
In starcraft you'll find out that every unit poses an importance in certain strategies
In red alert you’ll find out that every unit is completely useless apart from the few exceptions

Warcraft is a test of your micro skill
Starcraft is a test of your brain and hand
Red alert is a test of your patience

Strategies in warcraft changes according to the latest patch
Strategies in starcraft changes according to the pros
Strategies in red alert are ambushes

Warcraft plays you around
You play Starcraft
Westwood plays you and red alert around

In warcraft you say the word imbalance and everyone start debating on race, hero and units
In starcraft you say the word imbalance and everyone disagree in general
In red alert you say the word imbalance and you’re in the wrong discussion — every nation is almost the same.

Someone says Warcraft is crap and you will get pissed and start fighting
Someone says Starcraft is crap and you will cast a sideward glance and ignore them
Someone says red alert is crap and you will get pissed but still agree

Play warcraft long enough and you'll find out that it's a great game.
Play starcraft long enough and you'll realize that starcraft is more than just a game.
Play red alert long enough and you’ll think a good company is more important than a good game.

Play warcraft long enough and you’re thinking about what a fun game warcraft is.
Play starcraft long enough and your daily actions are enhanced by starcraft.
Play red alert long enough and your get more and more single minded.

Play warcraft long enough and you know more and more.
Play starcraft long enough and you’re asking more and more.
Play red alert long enough and you learning more and more rubbish.

Warcraft is the most brilliant game Blizzard ever created.
Starcraft is the art created by god via Blizzard for all gamers.
Red alert is the reason why Westwood sucked."

Let the ranting begin...

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DaFool
Defense Minister


Joined: 07 Nov 2006

PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 4:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

face palm. Defiantly by a blizzard fan.

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Destiny
President


Joined: 02 May 2006
Location: Singapore

PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 4:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Haha, most of the RA(1) ones are false. It doesn't include RA2, YR and RA3, keh.

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DaFool
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Joined: 07 Nov 2006

PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 5:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

If you play Warcraft 3, you like dragons and magic.
If you play StarCraft, you are brainwashed.
If you play Red Alert 2, you do so because you want to.

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Machine
Commander


Joined: 01 Feb 2007
Location: National Reference Laboratory for IPNV

PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 5:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

It's quite accurate, despite being highly biased. Also it seems quite old, probably this was made before the release of "The Frozen Throne", as it had island maps. And thus is likely just referring to Red Alert 2.

Anyways it's so biased it made me lol.

Quote:
In starcraft you can use marines to counter carriers...

Good times Laughing.

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need my speed
Cyborg Artillery


Joined: 13 Jan 2007
Location: Netherlands! Banned: 3 times

PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 5:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Most of them are right, but towards the bottom of the list the writer begins to say more and more that RA is crap...Which of course isn't true, right kiddies?

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Ixonoclast
General


Joined: 11 Aug 2008
Location: Somewhere up high.

PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 5:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

If you like StarCraft, you must have a humongous clicking arm.

And you randomly start blurting Korean words.

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ConMan
Tiberian Beast


Joined: 16 Dec 2008
Location: Toronto, Canada

PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 5:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Sindri wrote:
If you like StarCraft, you must have a humongous clicking arm.

And you randomly start blurting Korean words.


Powerful clicking arm yes. Korean words, no Laughing

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gufu
Defense Minister


Joined: 22 Dec 2004
Location: Tiberium Research Center N27

PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 6:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Sadly, blizzard was never able to make a game with ENOUGH UNITS. Durrr, 5 zeglings is an army.

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Vefbl4
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Joined: 07 Feb 2007

PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 7:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Starcraft and Redalert are good,never liked Warcraft much.

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ConMan
Tiberian Beast


Joined: 16 Dec 2008
Location: Toronto, Canada

PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 8:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

gufu wrote:
Sadly, blizzard was never able to make a game with ENOUGH UNITS. Durrr, 5 zeglings is an army.


Lol, I don't think you've ever even played SC before, so how exactly would you know? Razz

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DaFool
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Joined: 07 Nov 2006

PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 8:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Starcraft has population caps. The game isn't strategy, it's a click fest.

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Machine
Commander


Joined: 01 Feb 2007
Location: National Reference Laboratory for IPNV

PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 9:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Population caps of 200 units, for relatively small maps, it's still a lot. More than what you will usually see on Red Alert 2.
Also it doesn't have proper superweapons so it's a lot harder to reduce the amount of enemy units. Ghost nukes really don't count, after all they're easily stopped, and almost never used, unless as an insult (same with infecting a command center), or when one of the players is clearly the winner, and used it as a finishing move.
So in the end, battles, if they reach the mid game tend to be massive, of course unless all you do is to spam carriers of battlecruisers, but if you do so against a human player you deserve to loose. Or you're facing a much superior opponent, in which case the game would end up early.

Also 5 zerglings an army, Laughing, 6 zerglings mean an early zergling rush, something that every player should be able to counter, also the player who performed that rush is then left with a big disadvantage, prone to fast retaliation. Even the AI uses them, you should be used to them already.

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Volgin
Commander


Joined: 07 Mar 2009

PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 10:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

If you replace Red Alert with Tiberian Sun, thats very true actually. Especially online. My God. Its like all of the XWIS players are brain dead morons.

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ConMan
Tiberian Beast


Joined: 16 Dec 2008
Location: Toronto, Canada

PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 12:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

DaFool wrote:
Starcraft has population caps. The game isn't strategy, it's a click fest.


Your name suits you well #Tongue

But anyway, no, it's not like that at all

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Ixonoclast
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Joined: 11 Aug 2008
Location: Somewhere up high.

PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 1:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

"Starcraft is the art created by god via Blizzard for all gamers. "

God is truly a horrible and cruel monster.

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Machine
Commander


Joined: 01 Feb 2007
Location: National Reference Laboratory for IPNV

PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 1:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Quote:
"WoW is the art created by god via Blizzard for all gamers. "

Sindri wrote:
God is truly a horrible and cruel monster.

Fixed.


You all need to watch a Korean pro match, so damn fast, I bet those Koreans aren't even humans, just robots made for publicity by Blizzard.

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EVA-251
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Also Known As: evanb90
Joined: 20 Feb 2005
Location: o kawaii koto

PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 1:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I remember this post....so much fail condensed into one glorious wall of text.

Not only can 99% of the RA statements be disregarded, but many of the Starcraft ones as well.

Its simply not worth time coming up with rebuttals for it, especially considering Starcraft online is just as shitty RA2 online, minus the excruciating lag.

Your average SC player has a vocabulary quite similar to your average RA2 player. Your average SC player has about as much tactical variety as your average RA2 player. The map set you also see is nearly as limited too.

Wanna know the big difference? Starcraft has 100x+ the number of idiots.
For example, in one game of SC, one of the "vet"s claimed that not playing Starcraft enough makes you lag. Yep, latency = internet connection quality * server status * hours played.

But I stopped playing SC online awhile ago...I'll take the ability to actually modify an imperfect game over playing the ultra-competitive bore-fest of SC. (by boring, I mean lack of fun- generally a goal that a video-game should strive to achieve.)

(but don't take that as ragging on Starcraft, it definitely is a great game, I personally enjoyed the campaign and online experience w/friends alot)

And Machine, I watched several, and lost a great deal of my faith in humanity. Watching people scream at the top of their lungs because some teenager moves his mouse cursor around and clicks at 0.5c...utterly pathetic.

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Machine
Commander


Joined: 01 Feb 2007
Location: National Reference Laboratory for IPNV

PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 1:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hmm, if you put it that way... you're right. Personally I just laugh at it, and don't get it how it's so popular there, it's a fun game, and it's great to play with friends, but that's it.
I usually avoid online with strangers, as usually all are retards, like in every game. Anyways, the best part of Starcraft are all the small map-mods that exist, IMO; the same goes to warcraft 3. Playing bomberman on starcraft was awesome, specially since it was 8 players bomberman.
Besides that, Starcraft is just a great game with a compelling story, which is harder to mod than TS.

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Team SomeGuy
General


Joined: 18 Aug 2006

PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 3:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

A lot of this is true, a lot is false (for all 3).

I found that having the mental capacity to move *1* unit with micro nets you 66%+ win rate in vanilla Generals.

I found that lacking the mental capacity to micro upwards of 60 units will get your ass handed to you again and again and again in both Warcraft and Starcraft.

Close air support is not only possible but often required in Starcraft.

Close air support is exceptionally unreliable in any CnC.

For both situations I am referring to having air to ground units arriving and fighting within 10 seconds of need.

Terrain must be figured into Warcraftian/Starcraftian strategies. It can be disregarded entirely in Red Alert 2 and Generals.

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inzane krazy
General


Joined: 07 Nov 2006
Location: God

PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 4:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I lol'd.

ultra biased piece of useless text wall.

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EVA-251
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Also Known As: evanb90
Joined: 20 Feb 2005
Location: o kawaii koto

PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 5:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Team SomeGuy wrote:

Terrain must be figured into Warcraftian/Starcraftian strategies. It can be disregarded entirely in Red Alert 2 and Generals.

Yeah, sure. Ignore terrain in ANY RTS, and you'll get raped. Its like saying you could disregard building resource collectors in RA2 and Generals.

And I don't think ANY terrain Starcraft has downsides to it; you can atleast make terrain impact vehicle movement in RA2...

(also, when was the last time you played stock RA2? better yet, when was the last time you dealt with elite dug-in GIs at the top of a hill? I believe the range would be...9 cells, compared to say, the 6 cells of a Rhino Tank.)

And CAS is useful...Atleast I'd say that it's useful in Generals. Nothing like having a bunch of Comanches supporting your ground forces. But your critique is INVALID in every other CNC, just about. TD, RA1, TS, RA2, YR had NO real close support aircraft. You can't complain about units that don't exist. All they did in those games was shoot off a couple of missiles/a burst of chaingun and fly back to reload.

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Ixonoclast
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Joined: 11 Aug 2008
Location: Somewhere up high.

PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 10:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

There was terrain in StarCraft? I thought the ground was made out of solid unbreakable supersmooth diamond.

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GeckoYamori
Cyborg Artillery


Joined: 06 Jun 2004
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 4:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I really hate what the competetive community has turned Starcraft into. With that much micro you'd wonder if it's even an RTS anymore.

Red Alert 3 went down this road and I didn't like that at all. C&C3/KW handles the micro/macro balance a lot better, and after some patches tank spam is a solid vanilla strategy but it will not work against every situation.

Warcraft 3 on the other hand feels like it's Diablo trying to pretend it's an RTS.

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Machine
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Joined: 01 Feb 2007
Location: National Reference Laboratory for IPNV

PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 5:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Terrain height is a key point in Starcraft BTW. Units attacking from higher ground get a bonus attack range and hit all the time, and they are also protected by the fog of war.
However units attacking from lower ground have their normal range, only 1/3 of their attacks hit, and have reduced sight range.
Besides that, there's the cover values of placing units behind doodads which are the same to being on higher ground.
Finally, everything else that terrain controls is building placement. It didn't give speed bonuses (Supposedly it does in SC2), but neither did RA2 (TS did though, and it also had deformable terrain, which wasn't in RA2).

Terrain is a key point in Starcraft, and, BTW similar bonuses apply to Warcraft 3. This is also the reason why Lost Temple is so popular online, because it offers a great way to turtle up, against ground assaults as it only has 1 entry on a cliff, and you can control expansion points from the higher ground.

Ignoring terrain will make you lose on both Stacraft and Warcraft 3, that's true, but this is also true for every Command and Conquer.

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