Urban warfare

RatsInTheWalls · Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 6:45 pm Post subject: Urban warfare

So there are some (hardcoded) issues with urban warfare. The range of occupy weapons is stuck on range 6.

So I was just thinking crazy stuff, like infantry that uses a spawning weapon as an occupy weapon to get around that range issue (infantry that carries around robotic drones to do the attacking)... when I had a really crazy idea.

Is it possible to give infantry an occupy weapon that spawns an invisible untargetable unmovable unit (without issues)?

Because if that's possible, you can just give WINDOWSNIPR who normally has a range of say 14 paces, an occupyweapon that spawns a "fake" unit with a sniper weapon with a range of 14 paces.

Am I just crazy or could this work?

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OmegaBolt · Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 6:57 pm Post subject:

Weapon range is not hardcoded it's just that all weapons need to have the same range.

RatsInTheWalls · Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 6:57 pm Post subject:

OmegaBolt wrote:

Weapon range is not hardcoded it's just that all weapons need to have the same range.

Well, that's the same end result, isn't it?

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ApolloTD · Commander **Joined**: 19 Nov 2003

Can't have individual ranges for infantry inside as those with lesser would stop firing so doubtful to see improvement there...

DaRTzO · Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 12:23 am Post subject:

No way to make them work with different ranges?
So they all fire depending on their range. ( distance of the target)

Atomic_Noodles · Defense Minister **Joined**: 05 Oct 2011

Say you have a Bunker with 3 Snipers and 2 GIs.

They're ordered in Sniper-GI-GI-Sniper-GI

When the Sniper attacks it stops abruptly. Since the 2 GIs cannot fire at the unit due to the distance they cannot continue the sequence until a unit they can acquire is in range. At which point the GIs will finally fire and allow Sniper 2 to fire.

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Agent Z · Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 7:34 am Post subject:

One should also make all occupy weapons be able to shoot over walls(and in general they should all be able to hit the same targets), as the same will happen if some can and some can not fire over wall. The one who can't hit the target would stop the building when it is his turn to attack.

RatsInTheWalls · Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 12:45 pm Post subject:

ApolloTD wrote:

Can't have individual ranges for infantry inside as those with lesser would stop firing so doubtful to see improvement there...

That's why you let the fake spawned unit shoot, instead of the actual unit.

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DaRTzO · Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 1:06 pm Post subject:

And how would you kill that fake spawned unit, seems like I could garrison a building over and over again to spawn units. Smile

Mig Eater · Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 2:15 pm Post subject:

The dummy unit wouldn't get spawned until the target is within the range of all the other garrisoned troops tho...

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Black Temple Gaurdian · Soldier **Joined**: 08 Aug 2010

Forgive me my lack of programming knowledge, but wouldn't it be quite simple to make it check range and then, if the unit's not in range of occupant A, cycle to B?
Or is it a processing power thing? Or a easy with the lost-in-shed source code thing?

PillBox20 · Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 3:50 pm Post subject:

Wouldn't "open topped" that is on vehicles be useful here, as well? Like all infantry inside the building are individualy used. No common range of their weapons.

Just proposing.

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DaRTzO · Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 5:34 pm Post subject:

That's actually a very good idea. Though having a more refined version of it would be nice.

After reading through the ideas of people in this thread, some interesting features could be added to this.

Weapon range bonuses when garrisoned, random damage to infantry? (bullets randomly hitting soldiers inside when the building takes damage).

It would make urban warfare a bit more interesting.
Maybe even give a range bonus depending on the building height. That would make urban combat even more dynamic.

Black Temple Gaurdian · Soldier **Joined**: 08 Aug 2010

Does anyone even read anymore?
Ares already has "random damage to infantry" thanks to its Trench logic.

RatsInTheWalls · Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 6:28 pm Post subject:

Mig Eater wrote:

The dummy unit wouldn't get spawned until the target is within the range of all the other garrisoned troops tho...

I realise that. Say, every spawning occupy weapon gets a range of 10. A sniper inside a building spawns a fake sniper with a range of 10. A flak trooper inside a building spawns a fake flak trooper with a range of 6. A chem sprayer inside a buildings spawns a fake chem sprayer with a range of 3.

Since the spawning weapon keeps that range of 10, it will always spawn the unit. But, the unit is immobile, so it won't start firing until the enemy gets within range.

And please, don't take this as a serious feature request people. This isn't the Ares Launchpad. This is just a brainstorm. If I remember correctly, the Ares team is already planning to make buildings open-topped.

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ApolloTD · Commander **Joined**: 19 Nov 2003

I do wonder how one intends to spawn those 'fake inf'

In order to maintain a firing link you'd need to use the aircraft carrier logic and that limits us to aircrafttypes and aircrafttypes insist on 1x1 foundation to be able to dock/return again and disabling that particular thing seems to cause crashes even if we made the plane thingy invisible then again that gives us problem of firing path looking wrong.

On other hand, if you plan spawn via mutations, those will have no link to the occupying troops regards targeting plus mutation would be blocked by very same building if wanted create in same spot.

Any ideas of using slave miner enslaves is also out of question...
OpenTopped buildings feature would sure do it better than the current framework.