Project Perfect Mod Forums
:: Home :: Get Hosted :: PPM FAQ :: Forum FAQ :: Privacy Policy :: Search :: Memberlist :: Usergroups :: Register :: Profile :: Log in to check your private messages :: Log in ::


The time now is Thu Mar 28, 2024 5:25 pm
All times are UTC + 0
Non Map Based Weather Effects
Moderators: Global Moderators, Red Alert 2 Moderators
Post new topic   Reply to topic Page 1 of 1 [14 Posts] Mark the topic unread ::  View previous topic :: View next topic
Author Message
Ich-Henker
Flamethrower


Joined: 06 Aug 2015
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Thu Aug 06, 2015 11:39 pm    Post subject:  Non Map Based Weather Effects Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hey hey,

I eagerly search for ways to depict weather to create more atmosphere or even playstile differences.
I have seen images of modders using alpha aimages such as clouds (respectively their shadows on top of buildigs and the ground) which looked extremely beautiful - others implemente some sort of rain.

Do you got some experience with it, different better techniques? And do you got some sources for alpha images - because to this date i am lacking photoshop knowledge and the skill to create this on my own.

Love to see your ideas or help,
#evil

PS: Sorry for missing out on links on this one... this is a rather bad example and contains no ideas Wink  

http://www.ppmforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=40314

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Lin Kuei Ominae
Seth


Joined: 16 Aug 2006
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2015 6:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

You can use Gimp and create very quick a simple cloud alphaimage using the Gimp Clouds Filter.
Play with the values to get a nice result. (see attached image)

You can check some of my tests for TI.
Some like this used a combination of particlesystem with a big rain animation.


This dirtdevil is using a particelsystem like the gas clouds and a rendered animation done in 3dsmax

Other things like tornadoes could be made this way too. The hardest part here is to create the animation. Coding it in the game is easy.

Beware: Weather effects can be added, but they can cause heavy lag when used on a map wide basis. Huge alphaimages to cover a big area are also very big (10MB for a single image is not uncommon) and can increase drastically map loading times.



Gimp_Clouds.png
 Description:
 Filesize:  81.56 KB
 Viewed:  1932 Time(s)

Gimp_Clouds.png



_________________
SHP Artist of Twisted Insurrection:  Nod buildings

Public SHPs
X-Mech Calendar (28 Mechs for GDI and Nod)
5 GDI, 5 Nod, 1 Mutant, 1 Scrin unit, 1 GDI building

Tools
Image Shaper______TMP Shop______C&C Executable Modifier

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Ich-Henker
Flamethrower


Joined: 06 Aug 2015
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2015 10:47 am    Post subject:   Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Man, thanks! Thanks for the mini tutorial I will start to create my first cloud right now - just like your help yestrday that is a huge step for me.

...but I am already thinking about how to create it randomly in a naturally way, without creating lags or using map triggers ... *think* *think*

Do you know if you can craeate alpha image animations - it would be perfect if the cloud alpha images could scroll ....

anyway, I am looking forward to this - gimp, here i come  Cool

And sorry for asking something more do I convert to alpha image via shape editor or (import and then change palette)?

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Lin Kuei Ominae
Seth


Joined: 16 Aug 2006
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2015 11:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Animated alpha images are possible, but need some good ini coding knowledge. (e.g. animated alpha on TI nuke explosion)

I wouldn't suggest adding such things map wide, due to highly possible lag.
As an alternative to an alphaimage, you can also experiment with a normal transparent animation.
An invisible building using an activeanim with Translucency=75 could work too.
Then a mapper can place these invisible dummy buildings like light posts to add the desired cloud, rain, snow etc effect.

Randomness is problematic, since some keys cause sync-losses in online games. So it's best to stick to a simple looping anim.

Also note that some things like gas clouds and smoke can be affected by the rules.ini WindDirection key. Clouds moving in opposite directions than other anims can look bad.


For the conversion use SHP Builder and follow these steps
-create a new SHP with the correct size (importing images doesn't work for alphaimages, thus this step)
-load the alphapalette (see attachment) (only this JASC palette provides a true 8bit greyscale from 0,0,0 to 255,255,255 palette. the games palette format only provides it in 6bit thus in steps of 4,4,4 and SHP Builder can't load JASC palettes for image import)
-now copy paste the alpha image into SHP builder in the open empty SHP.

save and done.



alpha.pal
 Description:

Download
 Filename:  alpha.pal
 Filesize:  3.27 KB
 Downloaded:  7 Time(s)


_________________
SHP Artist of Twisted Insurrection:  Nod buildings

Public SHPs
X-Mech Calendar (28 Mechs for GDI and Nod)
5 GDI, 5 Nod, 1 Mutant, 1 Scrin unit, 1 GDI building

Tools
Image Shaper______TMP Shop______C&C Executable Modifier

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Ich-Henker
Flamethrower


Joined: 06 Aug 2015
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2015 12:28 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Is there a color in the palette that the game won't display, so the clouds aren't surrounded by alphaimage lightning (or that my several cloud holes show the battlefield uncovered)?

I'll attach a little ingame pic when I am done, looks beautiful Smile (man thanks)

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Ich-Henker
Flamethrower


Joined: 06 Aug 2015
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2015 12:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Cool Number 127

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Ich-Henker
Flamethrower


Joined: 06 Aug 2015
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2015 2:38 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

So:



Clouds.jpg
 Description:
I made it so that overlapping alpha images wouldn't cause unnatural spots - my first attempt at clouds and i am pretty satisfied. i like how it is not above the shroud and how it enlights certain parts of neighbor buildings!!
 Filesize:  191.26 KB
 Viewed:  1843 Time(s)

Clouds.jpg



Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Lin Kuei Ominae
Seth


Joined: 16 Aug 2006
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2015 2:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

The transition from cloud to unclouded is quite sharp, but otherwise a good start.

_________________
SHP Artist of Twisted Insurrection:  Nod buildings

Public SHPs
X-Mech Calendar (28 Mechs for GDI and Nod)
5 GDI, 5 Nod, 1 Mutant, 1 Scrin unit, 1 GDI building

Tools
Image Shaper______TMP Shop______C&C Executable Modifier

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Ich-Henker
Flamethrower


Joined: 06 Aug 2015
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2015 2:48 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread


Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Ich-Henker
Flamethrower


Joined: 06 Aug 2015
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2015 3:19 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

?



Clouds2.jpg
 Description:
It's a shame that bigger alpha images cause lag because this really could change the aesthetics and the mood of the game.
 Filesize:  149.89 KB
 Viewed:  1825 Time(s)

Clouds2.jpg



Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Ich-Henker
Flamethrower


Joined: 06 Aug 2015
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2015 5:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Lin Kuei Ominae wrote:
You can use Gimp and create very quick a simple cloud alphaimage using the Gimp Clouds Filter.
Play with the values to get a nice result. (see attached image)

You can check some of my tests for TI.
Some like this used a combination of particlesystem with a big rain animation.


This dirtdevil is using a particelsystem like the gas clouds and a rendered animation done in 3dsmax

Other things like tornadoes could be made this way too. The hardest part here is to create the animation. Coding it in the game is easy.

Beware: Weather effects can be added, but they can cause heavy lag when used on a map wide basis. Huge alphaimages to cover a big area are also very big (10MB for a single image is not uncommon) and can increase drastically map loading times.


You are talented as hell!

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Ich-Henker
Flamethrower


Joined: 06 Aug 2015
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2015 5:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Lin Kuei Ominae wrote:
Animated alpha images are possible, but need some good ini coding knowledge. (e.g. animated alpha on TI nuke explosion)

I wouldn't suggest adding such things map wide, due to highly possible lag.
As an alternative to an alphaimage, you can also experiment with a normal transparent animation.
An invisible building using an activeanim with Translucency=75 could work too.
Then a mapper can place these invisible dummy buildings like light posts to add the desired cloud, rain, snow etc effect.

Randomness is problematic, since some keys cause sync-losses in online games. So it's best to stick to a simple looping anim.


Also note that some things like gas clouds and smoke can be affected by the rules.ini WindDirection key. Clouds moving in opposite directions than other anims can look bad.


For the conversion use SHP Builder and follow these steps
-create a new SHP with the correct size (importing images doesn't work for alphaimages, thus this step)
-load the alphapalette (see attachment) (only this JASC palette provides a true 8bit greyscale from 0,0,0 to 255,255,255 palette. the games palette format only provides it in 6bit thus in steps of 4,4,4 and SHP Builder can't load JASC palettes for image import)
-now copy paste the alpha image into SHP builder in the open empty SHP.

save and done.


Hey ... got some little questions - yesterday you taught me how to convert a shp onto a new palette. This however doesnt seem to go so easy with my alpha.pal cloud image, when i want to use it for an animational approach.
Is this a moment for using custom palettes?

Thanks anyway!

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
EricAnimeFreak
Tiberian Fiend


Joined: 14 Sep 2009
Location: USA New England

PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2015 3:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Quote:
Randomness is problematic, since some keys cause sync-losses in online games. So it's best to stick to a simple looping anim.


Randomizing weather effects is possible with triggers. Just complicated. And should have no issues with desyncs. As for traditional weather effects, a common practice is a modification of global weather storms, using home made animations. Of course this won't give you as finite a control on a map as way points with effects attached to them will. As for the fine art of animation, don't ask me advice on it, cause I'm not so good with art.

_________________
Grab my Map Logic Expansion Pack 5.2 here!
Adds random weather patterns into maps.
More disabled navalyards.
Preplaced Neutral buildings.
Additional new features.

Enjoy Everyone!

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Lin Kuei Ominae
Seth


Joined: 16 Aug 2006
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2015 11:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

^^ah, right. forgot about that.
Trigger can be of course used as well to play animations on certain waypoints.

Ich-Henker wrote:
This however doesnt seem to go so easy with my alpha.pal cloud image, when i want to use it for an animational approach.
Is this a moment for using custom palettes?

I don't think a new palette for the game is necessary. The greyscale range of unittem.pal should be sufficient for some simple cloud anim (especially when you use a high transparency, the lack of colors shouldn't be noticeable)

A special palette for the conversion only can be indeed created, so SHP builder can't mix up the colors.
e.g. create a palette where you make all colors green, except the greyscale range.
Then use this palette when you import the images into SHP Builder.
This way SHP Builder can't use for example the glowing colors from index 240 to 255.

_________________
SHP Artist of Twisted Insurrection:  Nod buildings

Public SHPs
X-Mech Calendar (28 Mechs for GDI and Nod)
5 GDI, 5 Nod, 1 Mutant, 1 Scrin unit, 1 GDI building

Tools
Image Shaper______TMP Shop______C&C Executable Modifier

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic Page 1 of 1 [14 Posts] Mark the topic unread ::  View previous topic :: View next topic
 
Share on TwitterShare on FacebookShare on Google+Share on DiggShare on RedditShare on PInterestShare on Del.icio.usShare on Stumble Upon
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum


Powered by phpBB © phpBB Group

[ Time: 0.7860s ][ Queries: 16 (0.6163s) ][ Debug on ]