Also Known As: banshee_revora (Steam) Joined: 15 Aug 2002 Location: Brazil
Posted: Sat Oct 07, 2006 2:51 am Post subject:
New PodCast available!
Subject description: Now conducted by a disguised Predator...
Predator has recently uploaded the latest C&C3 Podcast. It's a 40:31 minute mp3 file full of gameplay information. The interviewed guys were Jason Blender and Greg Black. The podcast covers MCV, squads and also, they confirm that there will be no gates. The main focus of the game is battle, instead of economy/wall management.
Another suspect thing discussed in there is the crane, which would be a weaker and more vulnerable version of the construction yard, but it would allow players to build multiples buildings... like barracks.
This has been the most productive and informative podcast about C&C3 I've seen so far. Definitelly worth listening. Unfortunatelly, APOC wasn't rescued yet, guys... QUICK_EDIT
Dammit.. another feature to be added for CNC3:Retro..
And its not about laziness, its just that gates would go against the kind of gameplay they wish to have.
It wouldn't be so bad if they intended on having them in campaign..
This is annoying, I have 30 mins before work.. and a 40 min podcast.. I now have to wait! But it does sound like it'll be worth it..
EDIT: Okay, within the first minute its clear to me. "Predator" is Apoc, just had his voice modified to sound different. But the general characteristics of his speech, the pauses... I'm sorry, its Apoc
(And in the unlikely event that Predator isn't actually Apoc.. dude.. what a voice .. reminds me of some tacky 1990's shows..) _________________ If there is a problem on the forums, PM me. QUICK_EDIT
Guess EA couldn't find a guy to do Apocs job half as well as Apoc. I have some stuff to mention in the morning, to tired to think straight enough to post properly. But it's mainly about EA not using squads right, I was pretty much pleased with everything but that... QUICK_EDIT
Joined: 19 Aug 2006 Location: Sofia, Bulgaria, Yellow Zone
Posted: Sat Oct 07, 2006 12:44 pm Post subject:
LoL, the podcast was very long and indeed worth listening, but i thnik that Predator's faggot like voice was touched up... It had a very low pitch, and if try to make it higher i think that we will find that this is APOC. _________________ The only true freedom is the one you have won. QUICK_EDIT
Guess EA couldn't find a guy to do Apocs job half as well as Apoc. I have some stuff to mention in the morning, to tired to think straight enough to post properly. But it's mainly about EA not using squads right, I was pretty much pleased with everything but that...
Apoc IS Predator. Else he wouldn't have his voice distorted and then SAY it is Distorted...If he didn't mention it, we might've been confused and thought it was a black man that was speaking. QUICK_EDIT
They're in, and I have to say I like the idea of them.
I look forward to controlling whole hoards of basic infantry, while still keeping the specialist units seperate.
I especially like the idea of the 2 team sniper.. a sniper and scout . _________________ If there is a problem on the forums, PM me. QUICK_EDIT
I like the way they are making the squads - effectively what the infantry in TD and RA represented.
Although i think it would be cool to have the squads like in DoW, but that isn't C&C-esque.
All in all, it sounds ok. _________________ Organised Rules.ini by Judeau QUICK_EDIT
I really like the squads thing, but I think EA is going about them all wrong. They need to make it to where one unit is four guys and call it a fire team. Then they need to alter Transports so they can carry a squad of two fire teams, or eight standard infantry. All I'm saying is EA should put a little more effort in making realistic troop deployments. I guess it's nothing that a little rules editing won't fix, I could have it done in a few minutes if it works the way I'm guessing it does... QUICK_EDIT
@mr.pokey-yup,i have to agree with oyu on that point,but i kinda thnik that the squads should have more availible weapons other then just rockets and rifles.....are they having more?or am i just being a newb and not reading stuff. _________________ QUICK_EDIT
I don't like the way that, from what i have heard, you can fit only one engineer in an APC. One squad - fine, that's a group of people. But one guy with a wrench taking up the entire APC? _________________ Organised Rules.ini by Judeau QUICK_EDIT
Indeed, I don't like that either. There should be a better way to code it, something similar to the logic of RA2.
That said, they'd also have to make an account for when the squad is damaged, and half of their team are dead.. in which case, you could technically fit in 2 half-health squads in place of one full health squad.. so.. probably too much coding than they really want to do. _________________ If there is a problem on the forums, PM me. QUICK_EDIT
But if they want quality gameplay, they should really spend a little extra time working on things like that. _________________ Organised Rules.ini by Judeau QUICK_EDIT
Specially since squads never really seemed CNC to begin with. (they were always SINGLE soldier graphics why change?)
And theyre doing the MCV thing all wrong.
it should be it just queues structures in series so moronic macromanagement is reduced. Not this "crane" thingy though the mini-MCV I heard about in April sounds interesting to say the least. QUICK_EDIT
I like the developments to the MCV and to squads.
You can't say its not very CNCish, when, earlier, the games were graphically limited, in TD, infantry were only a few pixels, it would have been damn near impossible to have squads.
Now you can easily make squads possible, and I have to say I look forward to using them.
And with regard to the MCV and Mini-MCV thing. Its a compromise between the Pre-Generals fans, and the Generals fans, and something, I think could work quite well. (Well, at least the idea of the MCV and Crane.. still don't know of the mini-MCV)
There is wanting things which remind you of the previous games, and which seem related to them, and an evolution to them.
And there is just being stuck in the past.
I don't want a remake of Tiberian Dawn, or Tiberian Sun. I want a game which is built up from them, but with new features, new improvements, and a lot of interesting changes to the old games. _________________ If there is a problem on the forums, PM me. QUICK_EDIT
Joined: 25 Aug 2004 Location: DAS BOOT IM DER OSTSEE
Posted: Sat Oct 07, 2006 10:08 pm Post subject:
We'll live without gates. One game had them, no need to cry.
And about squads, six infantry is a normal squad, broken up into two teams.
eg:
Squad: XOOXOO
X=Team Leader
O=Squad Member
So the squadnumbers arent so bad at all. I'd prefer the snipers to be single...i mean, I cant see the need for a real scout in a GAME, now in real life? yea, thats nice to have.
Quote:
Apoc IS Predator. Else he wouldn't have his voice distorted and then SAY it is Distorted...If he didn't mention it, we might've been confused and thought it was a black man that was speaking. #Tongue
I'd prefer it if the crane thing was actually an upgrade, like an extra assembly area in the Construction yard allowing for more than one thing to be built at a time. But I guess that would cause some balancing issues, and maybe defeat the purpose of having it there all together. Any who, the crane is a brilliant move for EA and I'm glad they made it...
The mini MCV sounds quite intriguing, reminds me of something I saw involved in a mod some time back. It was called a construction node and it was this fast little vehicle that you could deploy and build stuff off of, but couldn't build anything itself. Like all things that will be in this game, as long as EA sets it up right it'll be widely used...
The squads I'm a little confused about but still looking forward to using. Gates I never used anyway so it didn't bother me that they wouldn't be returning. The fact that the Avatar and Juggernaut won't have build limits was good news for me. I think that's just about it, can't really think of anything else to comment on right now...
EDIT: I'm not sure how the military works in your country Carno, but it's four men to a fireteam where I live and two fireteams to a squad... QUICK_EDIT
i dont get thing with squads...
first they say its while building it like individual
but only for graphic estetics it looks like more soldiers, but later they say that squads are made of individuals...
lol so wtf?
as for avatar upgrades, i find it nice feature.
as for gates... well never used them in TS/FS to be honest but base should have one
if for nothing then for estetics, i mean why the ztype are they so lazy in some things?
they cant make perfect game so pls cut the crap with needed/not needed things... QUICK_EDIT
You build a squad as one infantry unit.
So when you click one infantry, rather than getting actually one infantry, you get one squad of infantry.
The number in the squad depends on the infantry type.
Squads act like individual units, but you control them as a whole. They are all individually affected by range and proximity to objects and the like.
Basically, for your control, they act like a single unit. Thats what they're going on about. But they themselves act individually and individual. _________________ If there is a problem on the forums, PM me. QUICK_EDIT
I played Star Wars - Empire at War and I really disliked the squads
Clicking a building and then selecting it's build option is not evolution at all, it also conflicts with that "fast and fluit gameplay" they keep mentioning.
Also, I'm not sure if I understood the idea of cranes right... But I really hope you won't be able to build more than 2 buildings at the same time; this has nothing to do with fast and fluit gameplay, but with keeping strategy in the game (making players having to make decisions on what building to build first, etc.) and not having a building spam fest 2007/ _________________ QUICK_EDIT
Okay, I'm having a hard time understanding why it is so hard for any of you to understand what these squads are. The lot of you are quite possibly the most intelligent group of people I've ever dealt with, and why any of you are having the slightest bit of difficulty in comprehending any of this escapes me.
The squad in command and conquer 3 is a group of six individual units that will work in complete unison. They will move as one, they will attack as one, they may take damage a six, but will remain the equivalent of one. So you can not tell soldier six to go hide behind a bush, and soldier two to stand in the middle of the road, and soldier one to pee on soldier five, it doesn't make them any more or any less of what a soldier was in any of the previous games.
They will take the same amount of damage as any unit from the other CnC's, they will deal the same amount of damage as any unit from the other CnC's, they will gain veterancy like any other unit from the other CnC's. They are only only a squad graphically, and that's as far as that subject goes.
Now for Bittah Commanders comment of the building thing. The sidebar is still in use, the gameplay of the previous CnC's is still in use. So you can also manage building from the inside like Generals doesn't change any of that. EA wants this game to work for everyone, from the AoE fans to the CnC fans.
And Bittah, you can't tell me that not once have you wished that you could build more than one building at a time? Ever said "I want to build that battle lab, but I need another power plant to support it. Damn, guess I'll just have to wait." even once. I know I have, and I'm really happy EA has decided to do something like this.
You know guys, CnC3 was not made to appeal only to this community. And why anyone would ever create a game to appeal only to this community is beyond me. We are the most selfish, self centered, divided, unhappy communities on the planet. We can't ever agree on anything, we have massive arguments everyday, we look down on everyone that is not one of us. The GLA makes more sense than us. I mean god, the only thing keeping us together is the fact that we love to yell. And for most of you, the hatred of anything not Westwood.
...have you wished that you could build more than one building at a time? Ever said "I want to build that battle lab, but I need another power plant to support it. Damn, guess I'll just have to wait." even once. I know I have, and I'm really happy EA has decided to do something like this.
Bad idea... it will kill base management.
And what we have now:
No economic maganement (Lot of tiberium)
+ No base management
+ No unit managemet (now squads)
+ Usuall for every CnC Rush Tactic
Are u sure that you still want to play this game? _________________ Gangster is a Project Perfect Wuj (c)Aro QUICK_EDIT
For one all squads would be heinously weak to any splashing weapons (Flashbangs vs Angry Mobs anyone?) and secondly you cannot tell an individual soldier to attack a separate unit like you could in ANY CnC to date (even Generals!)
Which brings up another micro issue. When a squad is under fire you cannot tell Joe Sixpacj whos taking all the bullets to move away and let the rest take over. No, under that system that same soldier wont move from the squad and since it is 1 unit it wont mean shit. QUICK_EDIT
And the 'squad feature' is simply a clone of the GLA Angry Mob from Generals that doesn't regain people out of thin air. Or shouldn't anyways.
Thus is a very indecent idea, as AM's were rarely, if ever, used. Sure they pwn RockVees (rocketHumvees) when the general isn't paying attention, but.. that's about it, they become cannon fodder when snipers enter the scene or Rangers with Flashbangs or Dragon Tanks get within firing range.
Imo, squads are a very bad idea. They were in HW2, I didn't like it much, it was (partially) in Generals, I rarely used them. Ok, fine, they're good against buildings & some tanks & stuff, but they become pwnt when snipers or explosives are introduced. OR chemicals. Making them useful against.. GLA explosives General and.. that's it.
USA Pathfinders, Commanches, and FB Rangers inside Humvees pwn them easily, Chinese Dragon Tanks & Gattling Turrets own them, little problem, and GLA Toxin Tractors & chemical weapons pwn them as well, as well as multiple other units for all sides.
(my) Conclusions:
Squads are a very bad idea.
Now, on construction..
Imo, makes it too easy. Sure, I like easy, but it gets boring if it's too easy.
I liked the RA2 style of factories & important buildings being on tab A & defences & superweapons being on tab B. However.. being able to build both a Power Plant & a Tech Center at once, or even a Barracks & a Refinery, or anything.. makes things too easy, too.. fast.. it would be simple for a player to establish a power plant, refinery, barracks, WF & maybe a rader even faster than in TS. Thus continuing the rush tactic in C&Cs; build up to WF, another ref, craploads of Rhinos (or Prizms/Apocs, who knows), send all tanks @ his base, win, repeat.
(my) Conclusions:
Multiple constructions = bad idea. But the RA2 style was good. Just stick with the.. 'classic' RA2 style with.. less.. cheese..
( Yes I know it sounds like I'm bashing EA but I'm just saying what I think )
( PS: has Muldrake or Banshee lost the unban feature in that recent h4x attack? )
( PPS: Don't delete this post, I SHOULD be unbanned by now & it took me awhile to type this up. ) QUICK_EDIT
All of those weapons were freaking made to kill infantry! Snipers are made to kill infantry, chem weapons were made to kill infantry, Flash bangs were made to kill infantry! It doesn't matter if it's a squad of eight micromanagable guys, or a squad of eight non micromanagable guys, they will both die at the same rate.
It's not like they are making it to where you can't micromanage your basic infantry, and your enemy can. You will both have the same vulnerabilities granted by squads and the same advantages granted by squads. You will both be able to exploit the advantages and disadvantages of squads. This is not going to **** up the gameplay or **** up the balance.
It is their for the sole purpose of making you feel more vulnerable when under attack, or more powerful when on the attack. It's a psychological tactic to make you get more out of the moment. To help make any experience with the game feel more epic than it would if you didn't have squads.
And if not being able to replace fallen soldiers in your squads is the whole reason you are all hating them so much, I'm betting EA has already figured something out. Something that will work just like the previous games if not much more efficient... QUICK_EDIT
Also, the squads make infantry more numerous on the battlefield, restoring the balance infantry/tanks a bit. One thing i always wondered about when playing TS is that when i got into the later stages of the battle, basically all you will see is tanks. The squads restore a bit of that, since you'll see more infantry now. (Or at least i hope so ) QUICK_EDIT
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New PodCast available!
.. reminds me of some tacky 1990's shows..)
Good idea Muldrake 
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