1. I think it's crap and no one should use it even for basic modding
63%
[ 21 ]
2. I think it's crap, but for small time just for fun modders I agree it might be more worth using than notepad etc.
18%
[ 6 ]
3. I think if Tibeds roblems were fixed and very improved it could be a new easier way of modding for all of us
15%
[ 5 ]
4. I feel unconfortable with using a program someone else has made and i'd rather do it the real way even if it's a little more time consuming
0%
[ 0 ]
5. I use Tibed myself and enjoy modding with it
0%
[ 0 ]
6. Other opinion, explain below
3%
[ 1 ]
Total Votes : 33
Author
Message
Kamuix
Rocket Infantry
Joined: 02 Nov 2012 Location: Canada
Posted: Sun Mar 23, 2014 1:03 am Post subject:
Tibed Discussion and Poll
Subject description: What opinion closest matches yours
I'm posting this because I feel Tibed is misjudged here that i want to discuss.
I've come to think that the reason many people cash Tibed is alittle
Although i've never gotten into public mod making of a large scale, but i've done ALOT of private mods and In the past since i was 12 and now i'm 25 and expressing my creativity was very forfilling whenever i came back to RA2YR it wasn't the game I modded the most my biggest modding game was C&C renegade but anyway back on topic
Tibed was a program i chose and favoured over the years because for simple private mods made modding rules.ini etc. to be able to get work done the fastest when it came to all that. I know tibed has it's problems mainly it's just incomplete, and i know many people feel more professional doing it through simple text since it feels more professional and maybe you feel more like a programmer,
My theory is though that Tibed is midjudged for people who just do private mods and want the modding process to be as simple as possible, try and look at this with an open mind. for people who just want to mod but don't have coders mind or big ideas for their little mod, i gotta admit I think Tibed is the way to go for people looking for a simple modding.. procedure
Another theory I have is that there's just a lot of hate for tibed because people want to feel like progammers rather than use a tool and feel ashamed about using someone elses tool and feel like a script kiddie or whatever you would call ut. tibed does have issues and much work that needs to be done on it but in my opinion if someone grabbed the source code and build off it to fix all of the problems with tibed couldn't we not turn tibed into an awsome userfriendly faster way to mod tibed?
But manly what i'm saying is I think tibeds alittle misjudged towards people who bring it up and get the tibed lecture QUICK_EDIT
Most Tags are self explanatory anyway so saying you need TibEd for it is kind of useless.
TibEd has the nasty habit of adding in its own tags too which in the long run clutters up the INI with redundant codes. _________________ ~ Excelsior ~ QUICK_EDIT
Posted: Sun Mar 23, 2014 2:53 am Post subject:
say no to tibed
well, those who have been around for awhile know the truth about TibEd. Its not misjudged. If you like it then great, but this comment makes no sense...
Quote:
Another theory I have is that there's just a lot of hate for tibed because people want to feel like progammers rather than use a tool and feel ashamed about using someone elses tool and feel like a script kiddie or whatever you would call ut. tibed does have issues and much work that needs to be done on it but in my opinion if someone grabbed the source code and build off it to fix all of the problems with tibed couldn't we not turn tibed into an awsome userfriendly faster way to mod tibed?
There is no shame....tibed is lacking... we want something better. IMO tibed sucks..... A lot of the community feels about the same.........
also the quote there is right from your post no edit.............. 2 words spell check.... _________________ I am authorized to send out the TMP Studio, PM ME IF YOU WANT IT And check this out, these were sent to me for help with terrain and zdata help along with TMP Studio/Builder
lets try and make it an open-minded discussion, i'm open to being convinced that Tibed isn't worth it for me to use but let's talk with an open mind and not be quick to spew hate.
So you guys don't even think tibed is worth it for people just goofing around with modding for little things? My older brother likes tibed when he would sometimes like to go in and do little things here and there, but showing him a text file he would never want to bother, also i began using tibed around 12 years old and it's always been very convient for small time modding
Of course im just talking specifically Rules and Art inis, i use all kinds of other tools for other things like soundMD shps voxels, cxx mixer is a must tool plus others. but i havent found a reason to give up tibed yet with how used to it I am anyway, it could be because im used to it too. but its more userfriendly for people just doing little things no? QUICK_EDIT
And yes i agree Nikademis Von Hisson it;s lacking and has many issues for big time modders and even for me but if a program like this were to be... remade or fixed and adancved i'm sure it could be an easier way to mod for many QUICK_EDIT
You can easily make a backup Template of a Basic Unit too. That takes less than 5 mins to make. Then just edit it from there.
I didn't really see how User Friendly TibEd's UI was and adding plenty of unnecessary stuff. Notepad++ also lets you download extensions which makes it far more superior to TibEd as well. _________________ ~ Excelsior ~ QUICK_EDIT
Joined: 10 Dec 2012 Location: I'm too busy conquering the world!
Posted: Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:40 am Post subject:
I can't see any valid reason why to use TibEd. It just clutters things up and adds more not useful things jammed up in the ini text, whereas Notepad is also useful for any modders, even to those who are learning how to mod the game, is much simpler and cleaner that way.
I personally don't like TibEd because sometime when the modder make a mistake, TibeEd can cause the game to have IEs. Also it makes the modder's job much harder to track down issues and bugs since TibEd does it all for them.
With Notepad, np np np, easy to track down issues and fix it less than 2 minutes with Find Tool. GG _________________ Mod Leader and founder of World Domination
As an editor:
- The main problem is that INIs are complex enough to put front-end validation. This is almost
impossible to fix. Examples:
Fields could be disabled that are not applicable to a section. Or if one or more field is dependant
on other, make user to edit them together. Or check for correctness of a value. Tibed allows to add
BarrelOffset/TurretOffset for Infantry/Aircrafts. ProductionAnims to Vulcan Cannon Tower etc.
On some cases, game will ignore but on others game will crash.
- typing something on those editable fields and then clearing is considered as edited and are put into INIs.
- it doesn't allow to remove a field, so have to use manual tab or a text editor.
- it shows zero for non existent fields, confusing further for beginners.
- it won't tell if a needed entry is missing.
As a viewer:
- if firestrm.ini entries are moved/merged into rules.ini, Tibed won't show [Levitation] and such
because it expects them in firestrm.ini.
- if a warhead is not declared under [Warheads], it won't show in Tibed. Parsing similar to
projectiles could have helped.
- on adding Image=E1x under [E1] in rules.ini and adding [E1x] entries in art.ini, it is visible
in both Infantry Objects and Overlay Objects.
- changes viewer doesn't show the difference between Crewed=yes/no and ignores deleted
entries completely (e.g. removing DamageParticleSystems won't show as a change).
- no ai.ini support.
Like SE2K, not recommended for editing.
Also, can't expect Tibed to support Ares flags for YR. QUICK_EDIT
why fix or remake it...... there is a better one that could use some upgrading _________________ I am authorized to send out the TMP Studio, PM ME IF YOU WANT IT And check this out, these were sent to me for help with terrain and zdata help along with TMP Studio/Builder
Tibed may be useful for those who don't want to learn, but, is that something to praise it for?
I can navigate INIs as fast in notepad as you can in tibed. If you haven't memorized the tags, the majority of them are provided in context and are just a quick Ctrl+F away. I've also found tibed to be more prone to errors then standard notepad editing, even with the increased likelihood of typos. All around I've found text editing to be far a smoother process and much more stable, though it takes a small amount of initial dedication to learn.
Also, as for your theory that people dislike tibed because they wish to feel like programmer... yeah, no. There are so many flaws in that logic it is actually rather sad.
First, just about everyone here can code the INIs... even just using the text files. Everyone is capable, so who cares how you do it? Second, I and many others here have experimented with programming at some point in time. Some of us succeeded, others (like me) didn't. Either way, we know that manipulating a configuration file is not 'programming'. Finally, you do realize that we are all dependent on community made tools to do our projects, right? We can't even mod the game without using XCC utilities. From there each facet of the modding community has it's own set of tools. We really don't care how you make something, just how well you can do it.
So yeah, if you want to stick with tibed, go ahead. You and others will get the 'tibed lecture' from time to time, but hey, why not be a nice guy and let us keep pretending that we are 1337 programmers?
A note about the source: I am first and foremost a gameplay designer and artist, to me coding is just a necessary chore that I do to put my ideas into the game. If there was a better way then text editing I would have adopted it. _________________ "It's got that Droke style to it!" QUICK_EDIT
Also Known As: ZivDero Joined: 23 Jul 2013 Location: Russia
Posted: Sun Mar 23, 2014 2:17 pm Post subject:
Tibed has a major amount of problems IMHO.
1. It makes a piece of crap out of ini's
2. It does not support non-manual editing of some ini's
3. It does not classify any tags in "Basic" as nesseccary.
4. It does not block you from or even warn you about doing wrong stuff: e.g. setting some tags to incorrect values, setting tags which if both set result in IE and stuff like that.
Ant this is only the small part of what Tibed lacks or it is wrong in. _________________
DarkVen9109 wrote:
What in the name of insanity is this? I FRICKING LOVE THIS LOGICCCC!!!!!!!!!!!!OOOOOOOOHEEAWWWWWWWWWWWYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAWWWWWW PEW PEW PEW PEW BOOM BOOM BOOM!! Nice I love this!!!! Ferriswheel bomb, Dive bomb. New Logic discovered thanks to Kenosis
Joined: 16 Feb 2005 Location: North America Posts: You cannot comprehend...
Posted: Sun Mar 23, 2014 7:42 pm Post subject:
The only game TibEd is useful for is Dune 2000, maybe Emperor as well, or C&C1.
Every other C&C has direct access notepads, WITH written instructions on what most tags are. Easy as ztype. _________________ Destroy to create. All for the hunt to dominate!
I'm not trying to praise it i just don't see the reason to have such hate for it that I see around here when someone brings it up. Having used it to make many private mods I know that it has many problems and needs for improvement but there's good things about it to I find i can maneuver through it and make mods much faster with it than i could with using notepad. Judging something by its bads and pretending there's nothing good about it you see what i'm saying?
Yes it has issues you can bypass to manual editing for individual things but it doesn't let you do the same thing for the entire Rules/art file. but you can import Rules/art from an existing inis.
Yes it fills the ini with ";copy of ___" code which is annoying and needs to be fixed. My private mod ive been working on has now over 200 units, i cannot beleive how many new things ive added and the mod runs smoothly and without crashes(other tha mistakes ive fixed) Hundreds of adding buildings too,
But like.. take the goods with the bads, yes I guess it doesn't make you feel as talented or professional when using a tool someone else made and i can't help but think thats why many people just hate the program without looking at it's positives
I agree that when using notepad it makes you feel more like a programmer or like you're truely modding the game yourself whereas using a program someone else made feels less talented.
But for people who don't care about that^ and is just a small time private mod maker who does it purely for fun and being creative I think Tibed is a blessing. Also younger people too
And of course the bigger point I want to make is... what if all the flaws that we claim to hate Tibed for were fixed in a new release? Don't you agree that if hypothetically speaking someone used the source code to fix everything couldn't we made an awsome tool for modding? QUICK_EDIT
TibEd is fine until you start trying to do interesting things with it. There are a bunch of clever little hacks and optimisations which TibEd just simply won't let you do.
As a TibEd user you also lack access to the same breadth of tutorials, advice, and help debugging.
And of course there's the part where TibEd will happily add unwanted junk into your inis.
A .ini file is on the very edge of being programming. It's assigning values to predefined flags, some of which interact with oneanother in interesting ways.
Kamuix, tibed is limited. Why would we want that? Its really not that much 'easier', I was text editing at age 12. Even before I got 'serious' with modding, I found tibed to be a severely limiting factor. The community as a whole, though not without exception, has selected against tibed modding. You've had plenty of people tell you more or less the same things as to why we dislike tibed. Either we are all brain dead in similar ways, or there is some truth to what were saying. Your call.
I want to know something, why do you care how we judge tibed? Is it a will to avoid or abolish the 'tibed lecture'? Is it that you think the software needs your defense? Does our view point of your chosen method somehow make you feel like less then a 'true modder'? _________________ "It's got that Droke style to it!" QUICK_EDIT
Aside from tibed having a habit of breaking ini's randomly, it not explaining what you're editing and why, it allowing game breaking conflicts, and it flat out sucking in half the stuff it's supposed to do. then yeah, it's great. _________________ MIdAS - Turning wages into beer since 2002 QUICK_EDIT
@Droke I like making forum polls =] just for fun ive made a few already. just for the sake of discussion and i thought this was an interesting topic I didn't mean to make it out like I'm putting up this big defence for Tibed or anything although I am a little bit.
"Kamuix, tibed is limited. Why would we want that?"
Well for every section there's the "Manual" setting to type in your own stuff, I know it's limited though I feel i've been able to mod faster with it but TBH i don't know for sure maybe i could mod just as fast and well using a text program I just thought this would be an interesting discussion since i was wondering why it's so hated that's all, i'm not arguing that it's good or it should be praised at all i'm just curious to why it's so hated that's all
Quote:
TibEd is fine until you start trying to do interesting things with it. There are a bunch of clever little hacks and optimisations which TibEd just simply won't let you do.
Fair enough. just our of curiosity could you give me an example of an optimisation that can't be done through tibed? I'm just curious is all QUICK_EDIT
Aside from tibed having a habit of breaking ini's randomly, it not explaining what you're editing and why, it allowing game breaking conflicts, and it flat out sucking in half the stuff it's supposed to do. then yeah, it's great.
TBH i haven't had internal error problems with using tibed unless I make a mistake that causes one that is out of tibeds control. But... maybe it's just luck?
Anyone can look at something or someones negatives and judge it or them based on them and I just feel tibed is alittle misjudged... just alittle i'm not trying to make this big defence I know it's incomplete and flawd etc. I've honestly been meaning to move away from it and adjust to doing everything manually
But does anyone kind of see where i'm coming from? that it's not ALL bad?
I always used Tibed because it was one tool that didn't itself cause internal errors. But i remember way back when i was in grade 6 when I discovered SunEdit 2k for tiberian sun and omg I LOVED that program for awhile it was really nicely done except I eventually switched to Tibed because Sunedit2k was causing me unknown internal errors whereas Tibed did not, that was my experiance anyway QUICK_EDIT
He claims not to praise it but yet defends it. I edit my files in a wordpad style program, then if i have a problem I run them through the IN validator or checker. For the AI I use the same program for 90% of it then run the rest through DCoder's Morph AI.
Never had any kind of error using what I use.... The majority of the modding world doesn't like tib...... just like the NPatch...... we live, we learn and use what works...
Tib sucks..... thats my opinion. Last edited by Nikademis Von Hisson on Mon Mar 24, 2014 1:58 am; edited 1 time in total QUICK_EDIT
Tibed has an interface that appeals to beginners, and it allows you to dive in to modding without any prior knowledge. So, not all bad. However, while that sounds like an ideal catalyst, I've only ever seen it be used as a crutch. So yeah, it has some good, but it just doesn't measure up to notepad; something everyone already has. If someone doesn't care about actually learning what they're doing, then it is a fitting application. Think on this though, if thats who we normally find running tibed, then what kinda of stigma will tibed (and return the users) gain? Does this make some sense to you? _________________ "It's got that Droke style to it!" QUICK_EDIT
Tibed has an interface that appeals to beginners, and it allows you to dive in to modding without any prior knowledge. So, not all bad. However, while that sounds like an ideal catalyst, I've only ever seen it be used as a crutch. So yeah, it has some good, but it just doesn't measure up to notepad; something everyone already has. If someone doesn't care about actually learning what they're doing, then it is a fitting application. Think on this though, if thats who we normally find running tibed, then what kinda of stigma will tibed (and return the users) gain? Does this make some sense to you?
Well said _________________ I am authorized to send out the TMP Studio, PM ME IF YOU WANT IT And check this out, these were sent to me for help with terrain and zdata help along with TMP Studio/Builder
IMO i don't consider defending something the same as praising it you make it seem like i'm arguing that Tibed is 100% misjudged and that it's the best modding tool for C&C YR but i'm not saying that at all I just went into detail about it =\
Yes i'm partially defending it.. but just to an curtain extent ..
Tibed has an interface that appeals to beginners, and it allows you to dive in to modding without any prior knowledge. So, not all bad. However, while that sounds like an ideal catalyst, I've only ever seen it be used as a crutch. So yeah, it has some good, but it just doesn't measure up to notepad; something everyone already has. If someone doesn't care about actually learning what they're doing, then it is a fitting application. Think on this though, if thats who we normally find running tibed, then what kinda of stigma will tibed (and return the users) gain? Does this make some sense to you?
Yes it does thanks, and actually I was using Tibed for several years before I realized that everything tibed does was simply all in a text file that was extracted from a mix file, so by the time i realized that I was SO used to Tibed and the way it worked that I feel and still feel i wasn't willing to adjust to modding the real way, which could be a bad thing? I don't know but I see your point
After looking through files like Rules.ini I understand how to mod with it and how everything or almost everything works, the Manual setting in Tibed has much of it shown to for each individual unit/building/other categories. After being so used to Tibed I just like how everything categorized into sections for you it's just easy to navigate. I have to do my sound modding in SoundMD.ini with notepad because tibed crashes as soon as you begin trying to add too many things to it's sound section.. atleast for me.
With notepad i could see myself using CTRL+F to navigate everywhere is that what you guys use to navigate around? QUICK_EDIT
Thats how I do, yeah. It will take a little bit to get used to it, but once you do you'll learn a few tricks to speed things along. Just a bit of practice and it will be second nature. _________________ "It's got that Droke style to it!" QUICK_EDIT
Aside from tibed having a habit of breaking ini's randomly, it not explaining what you're editing and why, it allowing game breaking conflicts, and it flat out sucking in half the stuff it's supposed to do. then yeah, it's great.
BS
voted 3 if multiple votes allowed also 5.
More interesting would be why people who voted 1 did not vote 3. _________________ Free Tibed!
EA for worst company of the decade! QUICK_EDIT
I never tried the TagsView plugin before, but right after I installed it I found that Notepad++ already comes with a feature called "Function List" by default (you can either enable it via the View menu or directly from the toolbar), which, for as far as I can tell, does the exact same thing as the TagsView plugin (it lists all IDs in a pane on the side of the screen, allows you to order the IDs either in chronologically or alphabetically and it has a search function).
I only noticed that the TagsView plugin doesn't show any IDs when opening a file that doesn't have a .ini extension (like .map or .mpr for example) and since Function List does still show them then, you're probably better off just using that instead of the plugin.
Edit:
To answer the TibEd question; I voted 1 and not 3 because it severely limits a modder's capacity to learn and whenever something goes wrong, he first of all won't know whether it was his doing or the program's and nobody here will be able to help him.
A modder can only change what he can see and TibEd only shows a portion of the things that can be changed and makes it impossible to discover new things that TibEd or other modders don't know about. The fact Kamuix has been using nothing but TibEd for modding for 13 years is the primary (or possibly even the sole reason) reason why he hasn't made any mods that are more interesting than the dozens of private mods he has made right now that are (apparently) not worth public attention.
His mods might not downright suck, but I can guarantee that if he'd have worked with a text editor instead of TibEd/SE2K for these 13 years, his mods would've been far more advanced today to the point that he'd likely have decided one of them was worth to release it publically.
Using a text edit allows you to discover new things and discovering them is a big part of what motivates and stimulates people to make more than what you'd call a simple mod in the first place.
So what it comes down to, is that TibEd flushed 13 years worth of potential gain in modding knowledge and experience down the drain for Kamuix (he surely did gain a little bit, but far less than he could have).
Even if the most intelligent programmers would improve TibEd to the point that they include everything everyone can currently think of, TibEd would still prevent individual modders from expanding their knowledge from what other modders already know since even today modders are still discovering new things you can do.
In conclusion; TibEd keeps modders from learning new things and it will prevent people who only make "simple private mods" from ever making anything more than just simple mods. _________________ QUICK_EDIT
You don't learn to look past the usual norms as technically your hand is held by limited editing software that is poor at being any good guide in long run and when problems occur, it is not good at all in helping solve them (you'll come ask for help...) and in the community we do not want to aid tibed mods, if you choose to use it, do so to your own peril as things that go wrong with it are astronomical given no safeguards within the program.
Maybe people will finally learn to bury TibED someday (wishful thinking...) but always someone has to come up like him to claim, oh you guys just hate it for sake of hate and other delusionalities to warrant their own use as never knew better sadly nor wished to.
TibEd is anti-modding at best unless you wish nothing more than doing those minimods so much which most aren't interested for... QUICK_EDIT
Have you not seen what possible workarounds you can make without using TibEd. TibEd in my opinion just severely limits the modder to only what the basic tags the community knew & what WW used at the time.
"Hacks" the community made provide some stuff only the TibEd Modders could only dream off.
Look at DTA,TI & TS Reform were able to come up with. _________________ ~ Excelsior ~ QUICK_EDIT
Joined: 09 May 2011 Location: Approaching the Great Pyramid
Posted: Tue Mar 25, 2014 2:00 pm Post subject:
I remember the 1st thing that annoyed me in tibed:
no option to change fast Coil weapon recharge
while early versions had this option, later ones had this disabled
throwing you with louzy info text that you need to edit this
stuf in art.ini --- WHAT THE HELL MAN !!! _________________
TibEd, while I personally dislike it and would not advise anybody to use it, is good for nothing more than a (Narrow) learning curve for modding. It's user friendly interface helps new modders to learn some of the basics but should never actually be used as a serious modding tool for any serious projects with any kind of actual ambition. A single simple answer to why is because of all the errors and issues it forms by itself which in most circumstances make a mod unplayable. It has it's bad reputation for a very valid reason, those of you who mindlessly defend the program need to understand that.
At the same time, the intolerant people (the ones who say "if you use TibEd, ztype off") also need to accept that some people prefer to use it over the (superior) text editors, but warning them that they are most likely going to encounter serious problems is obviously a good way to go, those who are ignorant and push away the helpful and truthul advice will only be a burden upon themselves at the end of the day. Gradually, if they won't take advice from modding veterans, they will learn things themselves the difficult way.
Long story short: If you actually aim to accomplish something, don't use TibEd, it will cause you more harm than good. If you want to use it as a getting to know the basics kind of tool, then no problem, but heed the warnings that the long-term modders give you and not some overly-opinionated moron. Most if not all the experienced modders here have learned what they know and produced what they have by using text editors (EditPad Pro is my personal tool of choice), there is not a single story of a well made TibEd production. Period.
I think that Bittah summed it up the best and is a good example of a modder that knows what he is talking about. People don't use text editors to "feel like a programmer", that's a stupid assumption, we use text edirors because they are reliable. QUICK_EDIT
The fact Kamuix has been using nothing but TibEd for modding for 13 years is the primary (or possibly even the sole reason) reason why he hasn't made any mods that are more interesting than the dozens of private mods he has made right now that are (apparently) not worth public attention.
His mods might not downright suck, but I can guarantee that if he'd have worked with a text editor instead of TibEd/SE2K for these 13 years, his mods would've been far more advanced today to the point that he'd likely have decided one of them was worth to release it publically.
you're kind of jumping to conclusions that you don't know to be true but assuming they are, I did more modding with C&C renegade with making maps and personal lan game maps, that was the game I modded for the longest but I've never been someone who committed himself you big mod projects and it had nothing to do with Tibed there's many more reasons why I never committed to a large scale mod. Also i lack shp/voxel making skills thats another large reason, it's just something i never got into
Quote:
A modder can only change what he can see and TibEd only shows a portion of the things that can be changed and makes it impossible to discover new things that TibEd or other modders don't know about.
In tibed for each unit/structure/etc. other parts of rules there's a manual tab where you can see the text and add whatever you want and i've done many things through that that do not show up under the sections theyve got displayed for you
I didn't mean to come us as to be praising tibed if i seemed that way i'm not Tibed lover It just... let's me work faster i guess for something that me and friends can play i find it's more worth it... For real mods obviously not i wasn't aiming at that
Many of tibeds problem could easily be fixed by a programmer with a source code... so the other point I was making the program is incomplete and if all the problems were fixed... (atleast the ones that are easy to fix) I can't help but think we would have a faster way to mod for everyone
I've been meaning to switch to notepad many times I just find it hard adjusting when tibed is so convenient i know where everything is I don't know i'm sure ill be able to get used to it fast
Also every Tiberian sun mod i've made with tibed I recall only getting so far before internal errors, whereas with Yurisrevenge I've been getting away with Tibed and my mod is huge my mod still works without crashes however i'm having map-specific crashes that i cannot explain.
TBH I feel more guiltier about taking shps/voxels out of other peoples mods than I do using Tibed so.. I'm a cheap look for the easiest way to make something as creative as i can kind of cheapo, theyre are shps that i did myself since it's much easier than drawing voxels atleast It seems that way to me just looking into the voxel editor, doing recolorings of units is fun though QUICK_EDIT
I've been meaning to switch to notepad many times I just find it hard adjusting when tibed is so convenient i know where everything is I don't know i'm sure ill be able to get used to it fast
This is exactly the reason why I wouldn't recommend TibEd to beginning modders or, to put it more bluntly, why it's poison to new modders.
Although the GUI makes the job seem much quicker and easier on first glance, this is actually only the case until you've gotten used to directly editing the ini files; getting a little experience, you'll be able to do the job with notepad just as quick and most important of all, you'll be able to do it more securely, while always knowing exactly what you changed (rather than having TibEd make changes you're unaware about). So when you do get an Internal Error you can easily trace back your steps to find the cause (or if you're using Notepad++, just keep pressing Ctrl+Z to keep undoing your changes until the Internal Error stops happening).
But the problem is, the longer you've worked with a program like TibEd or SE2K, the more you get used to using a GUI and the harder it'll be to switch to notepad afterwards; some people might still make the switch when they notice it's necessary and others never will.
Kamuix wrote:
I've never been someone who committed himself you big mod projects and it had nothing to do with Tibed there's many more reasons why I never committed to a large scale mod.
Most modders on big projects start off with small private mods and like I mentioned before, personally making discoveries while editing the ini files directly is a major motivator for modders to go beyond making more than just simple private mods.
TI started off as a "simple" mod as well (or rather, a singleplayer campaign) and DTA started off as a simple private mod just the same, but I kept its development entirely private for over a year before I finally made it public.
I mean, once upon a time it looked like this:
And I doubt I would have even reached that stage if I had been using TibEd or SE2K, given that they offer no easy way to add new graphics and if you still figure out how to do it, you might as well directly be editing the ini files anyhow.
In fact, I doubt you could load DTA into TibEd even if you tried.
Also, I'm not saying you should feel guilty for using TibEd, but I'm confident that any modder with at least a little bit of patience and motivation will achieve much more with Notepad than with TibEd, since after getting used to it, making edits with notepad is just as quick and it makes it more motivating (and in fact also easier) to experiment with things a bit and thus make mods more interesting. _________________ QUICK_EDIT
Joined: 09 May 2011 Location: Approaching the Great Pyramid
Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2014 1:32 pm Post subject:
Bittah Commander wrote:
But the problem is, the longer you've worked with a program like TibEd or SE2K, the more you get used to using a GUI
this
Bittah Commander wrote:
some people might still make the switch when they notice it's necessary
this was me
I was SE2K user and I found it "why would I bother with text editor when I can do all things in simple clicks ?"
then I tried to change simple thing regarding tiberium and new custom
unit that had to have 1 or 2 lines of code added by HAND
as damn program never "remembered" the change
soon after I had few units with same issue
then LKO introduced me with UMP for TS, and since then
i have reset my mod completely doing it solely in text editor
result:
- much cleaner code
- much easier to find errors
- much easier to add custom stuff that SE2k/Tibed won't allow you to
- much more freedom in everything
* not to mention that nobody here will help people who use these game editors as they break things alot _________________
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