Posted: Mon Feb 23, 2015 2:07 pm Post subject:
AI AA Spam
This has been a noticeable issue for quite some time now, but the Twisted Insurrection AI seems to really, really enjoy building Anti-Air defenses. Most of their base will be made up of Anti-Aircraft, resulting in very few RPG Towers or Obelisks being constructed during the late game, except for some rare occasions. At first, it wasn't a problem, but now it's becoming a nuisance rendering aircraft against AI opponents pretty much worthless. The codes are as follows for the AI's base ratio.
Code:
BuildConst=GACNST
BuildPower=NAPOWR,GAPOWR,NAAPWR ; buildings to build to generate power
BuildRefinery=NAREFN,GDREFN ; refinery ratio based on these buildings
BuildBarracks=NAHAND,GAPILE ; barracks ratio based on these buildings
BuildTech=NATECH,GATECH ; should build on each of these
BuildWeapons=GAWEAP,NAWEAP ; war factory ration based on these buildings
BuildDefense=GARTWR,NAOBEL ; base defenses are based on these buildings
BuildPDefense=GARTWR,NAOBEL ; excess power base defense
BuildAA=GASTWR,NASAM ; air defenses based on these buildings
BuildHelipad=GAHPAD,NAHPAD ; air helicopter offense based on these buildings
BuildRadar=GARADR,NARADR
ConcreteWalls=GAWALL,NAWALL
NSGates=NAGATE_B,GAGATE_B
EWGates=NAGATE_A,GAGATE_A
GDIWallDefense=6
GDIWallDefenseCoefficient=3
NodBaseDefenseCoefficient=1.2
GDIBaseDefenseCoefficient=1.5
MaximumBaseDefenseValue=60
ComputerBaseDefenseResponse=8
PowerSurplus=250 ; build power plants until power surplus is at least this amount (was 50)
BaseSizeAdd=1 ; computer base size can be no larger than the largest human opponent, plus this quantity
RefineryRatio=.16 ; ratio of base that should be composed of refineries
RefineryLimit=4 ; never build more than this many refineries
BarracksRatio=.16 ; ratio of base that should be composed of barracks
BarracksLimit=2 ; never build more than this many barracks
WarRatio=.1 ; ratio of base that should be composed of war factories
WarLimit=2 ; never build more than this many war factories
DefenseRatio=.4 ; ratio of base that should be defensive structures
DefenseLimit=20 ; maximum number of defensive buildings to build
AARatio=.14 ; ratio of base that should be anti-aircraft defense
AALimit=5 ; maximum number of anti-aircraft buildings to build
TeslaRatio=.16 ; ratio of base that should be telsa coils
TeslaLimit=5 ; maximum number of tesla coils to build
HelipadRatio=.12 ; ratio of base that should be composed of helipads
HelipadLimit=5 ; maximum number of helipads to build
AirstripRatio=.12 ; ratio of base that should be composed of airstrips
AirstripLimit=5 ; maximum number of airstrips to build
CompEasyBonus=no ; When more than one human in game, computer player goes to "easy" mode?
Paranoid=no ; Will computer players ally with each other if the situation looks bleak?
PowerEmergency=75% ; sell buildings to raise power level if it falls below this percentage
AIBaseSpacing=1 ; spacing between buildings when AI is building a base
See attached picture for the extent of the AI's drama. There are a total of 3 Anti-Infantry Towers, 5 Anti-Armour Towers and 14 Anti-Aircraft Towers. This screenshot was taken quite late into a game, I was spectating 3 GDI AI's vs 3 Nod AI's for testing purposes.
Note that this is an issue for both factions, not just GDI. Nod's Anti-Aircraft love problem is a bigger issue because their SAM's are 2x2.
OTTAA.png
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Last edited by Aro on Mon Feb 23, 2015 4:05 pm; edited 2 times in total QUICK_EDIT
Joined: 22 Nov 2010 Location: Iszkaszentgyorgy, Hungary
Posted: Mon Feb 23, 2015 2:14 pm Post subject:
That looks cool. Bless god mine doesn't do similar so I can still beat it with jumpjetspam.
Jokes aside, I'd suspect MaximumBaseDefenseValue as the cause first, it seems small compared to your DefenseRatio - I could imagine the AI builds AA defenses because with the others it couldn't build 20 defenses without passing that limit. (IIRC I increased mine to 500 after I had 33% at DefenseRatio and my AI spammed Pillboxes like crazy). _________________ "If you didn't get angry and mad and frustrated, that means you don't care about the end result, and are doing something wrong." - Greg Kroah-Hartman
=======================
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Contributions: EE Fixpack | Enhanced Edition Trilogy | DSotSC (Trilogy) | UB_IWD | SotSC & a lot more... QUICK_EDIT
PowerSurplus=250 ; build power plants until power surplus is at least this amount (was 50)
BaseSizeAdd=1 ; computer base size can be no larger than the largest human opponent, plus this quantity
RefineryRatio=.16 ; ratio of base that should be composed of refineries
RefineryLimit=4 ; never build more than this many refineries
BarracksRatio=.16 ; ratio of base that should be composed of barracks
BarracksLimit=2 ; never build more than this many barracks
WarRatio=.1 ; ratio of base that should be composed of war factories
WarLimit=2 ; never build more than this many war factories
DefenseRatio=.4 ; ratio of base that should be defensive structures
DefenseLimit=20 ; maximum number of defensive buildings to build
AARatio=.14 ; ratio of base that should be anti-aircraft defense
AALimit=5 ; maximum number of anti-aircraft buildings to build
TeslaRatio=.16 ; ratio of base that should be telsa coils
TeslaLimit=5 ; maximum number of tesla coils to build
HelipadRatio=.12 ; ratio of base that should be composed of helipads
HelipadLimit=5 ; maximum number of helipads to build
AirstripRatio=.12 ; ratio of base that should be composed of airstrips
AirstripLimit=5 ; maximum number of airstrips to build
CompEasyBonus=no ; When more than one human in game, computer player goes to "easy" mode?
Paranoid=no ; Will computer players ally with each other if the situation looks bleak?
PowerEmergency=75% ; sell buildings to raise power level if it falls below this percentage
AIBaseSpacing=1 ; spacing between buildings when AI is building a base
Of the ones above, all the Ratio/Limit flags are obsolete, at least in TS. _________________ QUICK_EDIT
Remove AA building from BuildAA. Or shuffle BuildXXX defense buildings. Change NodBaseDefenseCoefficient
and GDIBaseDefenseCoefficient to get quantity of base defenses with respect to base size with difficulty.
IsBaseDefense=yes on the building makes the distribution among themselves. Weapon type might be affecting
preference. Cloning the building for count, removing IsBaseDefense and giving only AIBuildThis is also an option,
but that will be constant across difficulties.
TI could differentiate by giving the upgrade ones for human and keep only 3 IsBaseDefense for AI with 2 ground
and 1 AA per side.
GDI gactwr logic is hardcoded and more logic with walls. Yes, Ratio/Limits are defunct. MaximumBaseDefenseValue
also may be.
YR has a different system when compared to RA2 or TS. It uses AntiXXXValue logic to make the ratio for the
number of base defense structures. QUICK_EDIT
Finally, this should be set to 0 for objects which are purely anti-air as aircraft do not use the threat rating values. NOTE: high values for this on BuildingTypes have been known to make the AI build many of them.
Now, doesn't that sound familiar?
Oh, and what do we have on both AA defenses?
Code:
ThreatPosed=20
So you should try changing this.
I think they shouldn't have it anyway, since ground units aren't really threatened by AA defenses, and it would be "smarter" for them if didn't try to auto-fire at something that can't do any harm to them. Last edited by mevitar on Mon Feb 23, 2015 7:44 pm; edited 1 time in total QUICK_EDIT
Edit: Thanks for the info, Mevitar. I'll try that now.
Quote:
IsBaseDefense=yes on the building makes the distribution among themselves. Weapon type might be affecting
preference. Cloning the building for count, removing IsBaseDefense and giving only AIBuildThis is also an option,
but that will be constant across difficulties.
Me, Bittah and Apollo were discussing this option a few hours ago. It looks like it's going to be the option of choice, but it likely means that the AI will go crazy with RPG's and Obelisks in comepnsation for the change. QUICK_EDIT
Paranoid did exist in RA, but you're right, AIBaseSpacing did not.
Paranoid existed in RA, but it's still not a "leftover" in TS; it's fully functional as you probably know if you ever tried playing a 7-AI game in vanilla TS Ah, the fun of getting hit by 6 hunter seekers after killing one AI. _________________ CnCNet Client | CnCNet TS patches | More Quality-of-Life Improvements for RA Remastered
Joined: 18 Jun 2005 Location: Dordrecht, the Netherlands
Posted: Mon Feb 23, 2015 8:18 pm Post subject:
Interested in the results of this one. As the question has been asked to me many times I really would like to know the cause and the solution to this silly bug/feature QUICK_EDIT
Finally, this should be set to 0 for objects which are purely anti-air as aircraft do not use the threat rating values. NOTE: high values for this on BuildingTypes have been known to make the AI build many of them.
Now, doesn't that sound familiar?
Oh, and what do we have on both AA defenses?
Code:
ThreatPosed=20
So you should try changing this.
I think they shouldn't have it anyway, since ground units aren't really threatened by AA defenses, and it would be "smarter" for them if didn't try to auto-fire at something that can't do any harm to them.
It seems that you were absolutely right about ThreatPosed when it came to GDI's defenses. While the distribution still isn't even, it is much better than it was, they no longer swarm their base with anti-aircraft and at least build a few RPG's alongside their Vulcan Towers.
Nod on the other hand, their SAM Bunker uses ThreatPosed=0 just like the Gattling Tower, and well, they seem even crazier than before! See attached images.
Still not an Obelisk in sight.
Edit: I may have spoken too soon about GDI. I just tried again on the Twisted Dawn game mode which disables the tower upgrades and the AI still goes crazy with anti-aircraft. Am I just being forgetful? I don't remember the TS AI building so much anti-aircraft.
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AI AA Spam
