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Feedback for DTA
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Valherran
Soldier


Joined: 28 Feb 2010

PostPosted: Thu Jan 01, 2015 8:05 pm    Post subject:  Feedback for DTA Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I have been playing this off and on for a while now, and there is some stuff I want to address. I usually play on Enhanced mode (because I have played classic to death), so anything mentioned here will be on that game mode.

1. The maps "Tunnel Train-ing" and "Radial Range" are available in co-op mode, however they do not work properly. If you set it to short game, everyone's MCVs self destruct at the start. But when it that is switched off, the game is only spawning 1 enemy to fight in 1 of the 4 locations on the map regardless of difficulty setting. This may have something to do with these maps showing up as a default map? That's all I can think of as to why its broke...

2. The Experimental Lab co-op mission was a pain in the ass, but only because of 2 things. First, Nod AI had Gun Turrets that were firing glorified Termite lasers, are they supposed to have these? Also, Nod was constantly getting a free convoy of these SSM launchers with chemical warheads. Are they supposed to get these so often? And are they supposed to be that OP? They can take out any base defense structure in 1 salvo.

3. Allied Chrono Tanks - When I build these, they are grayed out an cannot be queued until I deploy it somewhere and tell it to move. The picture remains grayed out after doing this, but if I click to build them, it starts building them again. Is it supposed to do that?

4. Starting Reinforcements - It's great that there is an option for this, however I did notice something. The machinegun infantry and flame troopers are the Nod variant, so if you get these using Allies or Soviets, they do not get their own version of those infantry, was this intentional? If so, you should consider giving their sprites a slightly different look because they look exactly the same, and give the faction the correct infantry variant.

5. AI and Aircraft - For some reason, the AI loves to build dozens of aircraft and send them to their doom. They barely take out anything doing these suicide runs and they just waste all of their money making them an easy kill. When they build these aircraft, I see them get like 2 or 3 at once coming from off map, and they constantly have a couple dozen flying around the base unable to get reloaded. Also, they send the aircraft to attack and then tell it to land near the target they hit to get killed. I fail to see the logic in all this, and it should be fixed.

6. Land Mines - I discovered that you can exploit these to gain promoted units. Simply build a bunch of them and shoot them and you will get fully promoted quickly. The enemy can do this too, if they shoot your land mines they get promoted. You might want to remove the experience gain from these.

7. Flame Troopers - These guys are a little under powered. It should take no more than 2 shots to kill an infantry unit (minus commandos), and sometimes I see it take 3-4. I often see my Flame Troopers die to a Grenadier after it shot him 3 times and he only threw 2 grenades.

8. GDI A-10s - How come there is a build limit of 3 A-10s, but Soviets can build as many MIGs as they want? That seems kind of unfair since MIGs seem to be better than A-10s.

9. GDI X-0 Powersuit - Similar to the A-10s, why is there only a build limit of 1, but Allies can build as many Chrono Tanks as they want? This unit doesn't seem that tough to warrant a build limit of 1.

10. Volkov and Cyborg - They seem a little under powered in stamina, tanks kill them so easily it's almost not worth using them in battle but only to keep them as base defense.

11. Death Crates - Would you consider putting an option in the game menu to remove them from the item pool? A couple times I had my base mutilated by the meteor storm crate because a Harvester picked it up...

12. Helicopters - They have flawed movement logic. If you tell them to attack something that is far away, they will fly to where the target was last located and THEN engage, this got my aircraft killed often. Also, they fidget around in the air too long between attacks. I know they did this in the original games, but it's 4 times worse in DTA and is unnecessary, this also gets my aircraft killed often and it needs to be fixed.

13. Ground Unit Movement - They all have strange movement logic. Instead of attacking immediately when getting in range, they want to move a cell or 2 closer before shooting. This got my units killed so often and it needs to get fixed.

14. Long Range Unit Targetting - Every unit with long range will not open fire on enemies within their firing range until they come within half of their capable distance. I don't know why they do this, but it needs to get fixed. I have lost many siege units to this because units are happily running up to them with minimal effort to shoot them when they should be nearly dead before getting to them.

15. It Came From DTA - I tried this out again, and the AI didn't do much to help. They kept triggering swarms of ants to close in on our bases and we get overwhelmed on medium and hard difficulty. If were able to set them to Turtle AI, maybe it wouldn't be so bad, but the options are severely limited. You might need to make a whole new AI script for that mode for this and future ant maps.

16. MCVs - Could you add a visual deployment grid under the MCV when selected before deploying? Like as it's moving the grid would turn red pending if the terrain isn't flat? That would really help in putting the MCV in the right place in cluttered maps. This could also be useful for Cruisers too.

17. Aircraft and Harvester Targeting - This is the most annoying thing I have come across, and it can be exploited. When an aircraft or harvester comes within range of your units, they will auto-seek them until it is dead. This means you can fly a plane over a group of mammoths or drive a harvester by a pack of tanks and lure them into a trap. This needs to get fixed ASAP, it isn't fair that your units will run off to kill those because you cannot tell them to hold position. but regardless, they shouldn't be chasing these across the map to begin with.

18. Would you be able to code in extra commands for the units? Such as Attack+Move, Formation, and Hold Position? It is really needed for this game.

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Lin Kuei Ominae
Seth


Joined: 16 Aug 2006
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Thu Jan 01, 2015 10:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

1. can't help about this one.

2. yes, supposed to be like that. It's a hard mission with special stuff.

3. chrono tanks are supposed to be like that. else you could build dozens of them, warp in one big army into the enemy base and win every match with them

4. Starting reinforcements are just a mixed group of units not considering the players house, since that is impossible. Thus you get GDI M1A1 with Nod light tank, soviet heavy tank and Allies medium tank. Same with the infantry.

5. AI attack scripting is a pain in the ass and especially aircraft is really bad to set, since many actions are simply missing.
There is  no way to tell the AI
-to build only as many aircraft as you have helipas
-to rebuild lost aircraft
-to head back to base after an attack, reload and repeat the mission
-to assemble an attack team of existing aircraft (only of new build teams)
etc

6. Land mines are not supposed to be used for easy veterancy.Removing experience gain is not possible since that is bound to the cost of an object. We would have to make them cost nothing to stop experience gaining.
However we could lower the guard range which allows to build 5 of them in a row, down to 3 or even less. With a cost reduction to only 100, they wouldn't be worth building for experience gaining anymore.

7. Flame troopers are actually very powerful, since they have a wide area damage, damaging multiple targets. Nod flame trooper are also very fast, while soviet ones have a nice medium range.

Valherran wrote:
8. GDI A-10s - How come there is a build limit of 3 A-10s, but Soviets can build as many MIGs as they want? That seems kind of unfair since MIGs seem to be better than A-10s.
8. GDI A10s are probably 10-20 times more powerful than Migs. A Mig can hit only 1 target with each attack and then only bring it to yellow or red.
An A10 can destroy many targets in only one overrun attack and an A10 can attack 2 times.
A big group of 20 artilleries for example can be killed by a single A10 in one attack. A Mig would have to attack 20 times to do that.
A10 have napalm bombs with area damage.
Mig has rockets which damage only a single target.

Valherran wrote:
9. GDI X-0 Powersuit - Similar to the A-10s, why is there only a build limit of 1, but Allies can build as many Chrono Tanks as they want? This unit doesn't seem that tough to warrant a build limit of 1.

engine limitation. When the chrono tank is deployed, the game forgets the buildlimit and we can't do anything to fix this.
However, the chrono tank is a lot weaker in its attack mode than the XO.
XO can attack infantry and armor. Chrono tank can attack only armor reasonable well and mainly anti-building.

Valherran wrote:
10. Volkov and Cyborg - They seem a little under powered in stamina, tanks kill them so easily it's almost not worth using them in battle but only to keep them as base defense.

do you considered using them in a helitrans to outmaneuver the enemy defense line and kill the base behind the front?
They are very powerful units and with the right micromanagement, they can lay waste to entire bases.
In groups with other units, their firepower can also help getting rid of enemy armies in no time.

Valherran wrote:
11. Death Crates - Would you consider putting an option in the game menu to remove them from the item pool? A couple times I had my base mutilated by the meteor storm crate because a Harvester picked it up...

That crate also gives a lot of credits Wink
But yes, a game option should be possible. It's up to Bittah to decide this.
Personally i wouldn't like it if there are only good crates and no bad ones.

Valherran wrote:
12. Helicopters - They have flawed movement logic. If you tell them to attack something that is far away, they will fly to where the target was last located and THEN engage, this got my aircraft killed often. Also, they fidget around in the air too long between attacks. I know they did this in the original games, but it's 4 times worse in DTA and is unnecessary, this also gets my aircraft killed often and it needs to be fixed.

There isn't a lot we can do i'm afraid.
It's simply the how the engine works.

Valherran wrote:
13. Ground Unit Movement - They all have strange movement logic. Instead of attacking immediately when getting in range, they want to move a cell or 2 closer before shooting. This got my units killed so often and it needs to get fixed.

i haven't noticed this yet as such a big problem.
They do sometimes drive closer than necessary, but some little micro management can prevent this.

Valherran wrote:
14. Long Range Unit Targetting - Every unit with long range will not open fire on enemies within their firing range until they come within half of their capable distance. I don't know why they do this, but it needs to get fixed. I have lost many siege units to this because units are happily running up to them with minimal effort to shoot them when they should be nearly dead before getting to them.

This is intentional so you don't simply place them somewhere and can forget them since they do everything on their own, with you drinking an coffee and watch them work.
It would be too overpowered if they guard with their max range.
Especially V2s with their enormous range would be unbeatable by any player when they auto-attack on their max range.
Micro manage and watch your units so you can use their full effectiveness.

Valherran wrote:
15. It Came From DTA - I tried this out again, and the AI didn't do much to help. They kept triggering swarms of ants to close in on our bases and we get overwhelmed on medium and hard difficulty. If were able to set them to Turtle AI, maybe it wouldn't be so bad, but the options are severely limited. You might need to make a whole new AI script for that mode for this and future ant maps.

This map is not supposed to be played with the AI
Co-op means cooperation with humans, not with an AI fighting an AI.
However on medium it's still possible to win this even alone.

Valherran wrote:
16. MCVs - Could you add a visual deployment grid under the MCV when selected before deploying? Like as it's moving the grid would turn red pending if the terrain isn't flat? That would really help in putting the MCV in the right place in cluttered maps. This could also be useful for Cruisers too.

not possible
the engine does not support that.

Valherran wrote:
17. Aircraft and Harvester Targeting - This is the most annoying thing I have come across, and it can be exploited. When an aircraft or harvester comes within range of your units, they will auto-seek them until it is dead. This means you can fly a plane over a group of mammoths or drive a harvester by a pack of tanks and lure them into a trap. This needs to get fixed ASAP, it isn't fair that your units will run off to kill those because you cannot tell them to hold position. but regardless, they shouldn't be chasing these across the map to begin with.

A huge bug of the TS engine and not possible to fix for us modder.

Valherran wrote:
18. Would you be able to code in extra commands for the units? Such as Attack+Move, Formation, and Hold Position? It is really needed for this game.

Attack+Move= CTRL+ALT + move order
Formation not supported by TS engine
Hold postion is the previous mentioned bug. You can press g for area guard however and sometimes the unit comes back.

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Bittah Commander
Defense Minister


Joined: 21 May 2003
Location: The Netherlands

PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2015 1:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Like LKO pointed out, many of the issues you brought up are caused by limitations of Tiberian Sun's engine.

I'll respond to all points that LKO hasn't properly addressed already.
Valherran wrote:
1. The maps "Tunnel Train-ing" and "Radial Range" are available in co-op mode, however they do not work properly. If you set it to short game, everyone's MCVs self destruct at the start. But when it that is switched off, the game is only spawning 1 enemy to fight in 1 of the 4 locations on the map regardless of difficulty setting. This may have something to do with these maps showing up as a default map? That's all I can think of as to why its broke...

Thanks for pointing this out; it seems that Short Game currently is indeed broken on the Co-Op version of Radial Range (the fact it's also available as a Default map has nothing to do with it however) and I'll fix this for the next update.
Are you sure that the Co-Op version of Tunnel Train-ing really has the same issue however? The MCVs aren't self-destructing when I try it.

Also, the number of enemy players that appear depends on the number of allies you have. If you're alone, then you'll only have 1 opponent, but if you have 1 ally (regardless of whether it's a human or AI ally), then you'll have 2 opponents and so on (going up to 4 opponents).
Valherran wrote:
6. Land Mines - I discovered that you can exploit these to gain promoted units. Simply build a bunch of them and shoot them and you will get fully promoted quickly. The enemy can do this too, if they shoot your land mines they get promoted. You might want to remove the experience gain from these.

Lin Kuei Ominae wrote:
6. Land mines are not supposed to be used for easy veterancy.Removing experience gain is not possible since that is bound to the cost of an object. We would have to make them cost nothing to stop experience gaining.
However we could lower the guard range which allows to build 5 of them in a row, down to 3 or even less. With a cost reduction to only 100, they wouldn't be worth building for experience gaining anymore.

Being only able to build rows of 3 of them makes it a bit pointless to be able to instantly build mines in rows to begin with, although that's not even the main issue.
The main issue is the price: the mines can't be made too cheap or they'll be used as a very effective base defense weapon that can be placed right next to enemy vehicles as soon as they approach your base (this is why mines were made a lot more expensive than they used to be when they were first implemented). There's no way to counter the mines when they're used like this and rather than mines, they're effectively more like instant wide-area-explosions that instantly appear on the enemy unit you click next to (kind of like mini super-weapons).

Personally I'd personally actually prefer to make the mines completely unbuildable.
Valherran wrote:
11. Death Crates - Would you consider putting an option in the game menu to remove them from the item pool? A couple times I had my base mutilated by the meteor storm crate because a Harvester picked it up...

I suppose that I could add a game option that disables baddie crates. I can't say whether this'll be in the next update already however.
Valherran wrote:
14. Long Range Unit Targetting - Every unit with long range will not open fire on enemies within their firing range until they come within half of their capable distance. I don't know why they do this, but it needs to get fixed. I have lost many siege units to this because units are happily running up to them with minimal effort to shoot them when they should be nearly dead before getting to them.

The reason I did this is partially what LKO said and partially also because of point 17 that you brought up. If long range units would immediately automatically target any enemy unit that slightly wanders within its firing range, it's more likely for them to start chasing down enemy units that were just "passing through" and for them to keep chasing that enemy unit until either one of the units is destroyed.
Mind that you can press G on your keyboard to put units in Area Guard mode however, which increases their guard range and will even make them engage nearby enemy units that are still outside of their firing range.
Valherran wrote:
15. It Came From DTA - I tried this out again, and the AI didn't do much to help. They kept triggering swarms of ants to close in on our bases and we get overwhelmed on medium and hard difficulty. If were able to set them to Turtle AI, maybe it wouldn't be so bad, but the options are severely limited. You might need to make a whole new AI script for that mode for this and future ant maps.

Like LKO mentioned, that Co-Op mission was originally made to be played together with 2 human allies.
In version 1.1345 I did make some alterations however, which allows the AI players to also deploy their MCVs and support you, but I made sure that the mission remained to be a challenge; even with 2 hard AI allies.
Although playing on Hard difficulty with 2 Hard AI allies is a challenge (as it should be), it certainly is beatable if you properly defend your AI allies. Same deal when you play on Medium difficulty with 2 Medium AI allies (although it's still a bit easier to beat than hard difficulty with 2 hard AIs) and so on.
This basically means that you have a lot of control over how difficult you want the mission to be, since you can individually control the difficulty of the mission itself and also the difficulty level of the AI players that are allied to you (the 2 AI players also don't need to have the same difficulty level). So whether you want the mission to be hard as hell or piss easy (but where's the fun in that?) is entirely up to you.

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Valherran
Soldier


Joined: 28 Feb 2010

PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2015 8:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Quote:
Are you sure that the Co-Op version of Tunnel Train-ing really has the same issue however? The MCVs aren't self-destructing when I try it.


If it didn't self destruct on you then it was just that one map then.

Quote:
Also, the number of enemy players that appear depends on the number of allies you have. If you're alone, then you'll only have 1 opponent, but if you have 1 ally (regardless of whether it's a human or AI ally), then you'll have 2 opponents and so on (going up to 4 opponents).


I had the maximum amount of allies in those maps, and it only spawned 1 enemy. It worked fine for the Experimental Lab map, but not these.

Quote:
Being only able to build rows of 3 of them makes it a bit pointless to be able to instantly build mines in rows to begin with, although that's not even the main issue.
The main issue is the price: the mines can't be made too cheap or they'll be used as a very effective base defense weapon that can be placed right next to enemy vehicles as soon as they approach your base (this is why mines were made a lot more expensive than they used to be when they were first implemented). There's no way to counter the mines when they're used like this and rather than mines, they're effectively more like instant wide-area-explosions that instantly appear on the enemy unit you click next to (kind of like mini super-weapons).

Personally I'd personally actually prefer to make the mines completely unbuildable.


What if you just made them a support power instead? That way you can remove the cost and give it a timer between deployments?

Quote:
I suppose that I could add a game option that disables baddie crates. I can't say whether this'll be in the next update already however.


Take your time, no rush.

Quote:
The reason I did this is partially what LKO said and partially also because of point 17 that you brought up. If long range units would immediately automatically target any enemy unit that slightly wanders within its firing range, it's more likely for them to start chasing down enemy units that were just "passing through" and for them to keep chasing that enemy unit until either one of the units is destroyed.
Mind that you can press G on your keyboard to put units in Area Guard mode however, which increases their guard range and will even make them engage nearby enemy units that are still outside of their firing range.


Makes sense, I guess I will have to be more observant than usual then.

Quote:
Like LKO mentioned, that Co-Op mission was originally made to be played together with 2 human allies.
In version 1.1345 I did make some alterations however, which allows the AI players to also deploy their MCVs and support you, but I made sure that the mission remained to be a challenge; even with 2 hard AI allies.
Although playing on Hard difficulty with 2 Hard AI allies is a challenge (as it should be), it certainly is beatable if you properly defend your AI allies. Same deal when you play on Medium difficulty with 2 Medium AI allies (although it's still a bit easier to beat than hard difficulty with 2 hard AIs) and so on.
This basically means that you have a lot of control over how difficult you want the mission to be, since you can individually control the difficulty of the mission itself and also the difficulty level of the AI players that are allied to you (the 2 AI players also don't need to have the same difficulty level). So whether you want the mission to be hard as hell or piss easy (but where's the fun in that?) is entirely up to you.


I couldn't beat this on Hard, there was too many damn ants barreling down on me and the AI. The AI was constantly patrolling with infantry and causing mass hordes of ants to close in on our bases. Unless you know a way to get passed that, i'm all ears as I have tried everything.

Quote:
8. GDI A10s are probably 10-20 times more powerful than Migs. A Mig can hit only 1 target with each attack and then only bring it to yellow or red.
An A10 can destroy many targets in only one overrun attack and an A10 can attack 2 times.
A big group of 20 artilleries for example can be killed by a single A10 in one attack. A Mig would have to attack 20 times to do that.
A10 have napalm bombs with area damage.
Mig has rockets which damage only a single target.


A-10s may be stronger with carpet bombing, but they are easier to shoot down than MIGs, and MIGs are fast enough to evade anti-air and will most likely hit their target before they are shot down. Throw 3 A-10's at a guarded Con-yard and they will die on the 1st pass. Throw 8-10 MIG's at a Con-yard and it dies before they are shot down, and some will have most likely escaped. Well, both planes have their ups and downs, I will just leave it alone if you guys think its fine.

Quote:
2. yes, supposed to be like that. It's a hard mission with special stuff.

3. chrono tanks are supposed to be like that. else you could build dozens of them, warp in one big army into the enemy base and win every match with them

4. Starting reinforcements are just a mixed group of units not considering the players house, since that is impossible. Thus you get GDI M1A1 with Nod light tank, soviet heavy tank and Allies medium tank. Same with the infantry.


Intentional. Gotcha.

Quote:
do you considered using them in a helitrans to outmaneuver the enemy defense line and kill the base behind the front?
They are very powerful units and with the right micromanagement, they can lay waste to entire bases.
In groups with other units, their firepower can also help getting rid of enemy armies in no time.


I have tried trasporting them behind enemy lines. But 9/10, the base is well guarded and they will get minced by the base defense and lingering units within the base. I honestly expected these 2 to be as tough as the Cyborg Commando in TS, but they are like 1/3 as good. lol, oh well.

Quote:
That crate also gives a lot of credits Wink
But yes, a game option should be possible. It's up to Bittah to decide this.
Personally i wouldn't like it if there are only good crates and no bad ones.


At the VERY least, make it so the meteor storm crate cannot spawn in your base, I really hate that one.

Quote:
Attack+Move= CTRL+ALT + move order


Oh yeah... Thanks, this helps. Hold Position is badly needed for that damn auto-seek bug though...


Overall, damn those engine limitations! Mad

I really wish the stuff mentioned above was fixable/addable! I will just have to try and ignore it I guess. -.-

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Bittah Commander
Defense Minister


Joined: 21 May 2003
Location: The Netherlands

PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2015 3:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Valherran wrote:
I had the maximum amount of allies in those maps, and it only spawned 1 enemy. It worked fine for the Experimental Lab map, but not these.

It seems the client currently only takes your human allies into account and not AI ones. I'll see if Rampastring can fix this.
Valherran wrote:
What if you just made them a support power instead? That way you can remove the cost and give it a timer between deployments?

The things we can do with support powers is limited because all of those in DTA are created by editing original super-weapons from Tiberian Sun (such as the Multi-Missile, EM-Pulse, Drop Pods, etc.) and none of the TS super-weapons allow a building (and also not a vehicle, in case you're curious) to be dropped/placed somewhere.
Valherran wrote:
I couldn't beat this on Hard, there was too many damn ants barreling down on me and the AI. The AI was constantly patrolling with infantry and causing mass hordes of ants to close in on our bases. Unless you know a way to get passed that, i'm all ears as I have tried everything.

Without the patrolling AI infantry, the AI's harvesters would be provoking the ants instead (so the Turtling AI option wouldn't make much of a difference).
Like I said, it's quite challenging on hard difficulty with hard AI allies (and possibly impossible with AI allies of a lower difficulty level), but it's certainly doable. One thing to keep in mind is that the greatest threat will be coming from the West, so you'll have to build flame turrets there to keep the AI's Construction Yards alive. You also need to take care to harvest the gems as early as possible (before the AI harvests most of it already) to give yourself a decent early income to build extra flame turrets with.
Try to expand your base towards the north(east) while fending off the ants coming from there with more flame turrets, until you eventually manage to gas the north-east ant hill with an Engineer.
During this, the greatest threat will still be the ants coming from the west, so make sure to constantly properly keep defending there as well.
Once the north-east ant hill is gassed, ants will completely stop coming from there and it should be much easier to keep yourself and your allies alive. At this point it's a matter of taking control over the old Soviet base in the center region and then finding and gassing the rest of the ant hills.
Valherran wrote:
I have tried trasporting them behind enemy lines. But 9/10, the base is well guarded and they will get minced by the base defense and lingering units within the base. I honestly expected these 2 to be as tough as the Cyborg Commando in TS, but they are like 1/3 as good. lol, oh well.

I'm sure you might have noticed by now, but DTA has a much better AI than TS #Tongue
Dropping a Cyborg Prototype or X-O Powersuit in an enemy base as a surprise attack works well against human players, but not against the AI (because it's not possible to actually "surprise" the AI). The AI's numerous units in the area respond immediately and will move in to take it out.
It's best to always properly defend your "epic units" with other units when they're on the frontline.
Valherran wrote:
At the VERY least, make it so the meteor storm crate cannot spawn in your base, I really hate that one.

I have no control over which crate goodie appears [/i]where[/i]. Meteors already do very little damage against structures however.
Valherran wrote:
Hold Position is badly needed for that damn auto-seek bug though...

Yeah, that bug is indeed quite annoying; it might be the most annoying aspect of the TS engine.
Valherran wrote:
Overall, damn those engine limitations! Mad

Yeah, tell me about it Sad

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Valherran
Soldier


Joined: 28 Feb 2010

PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2015 11:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

A few more things:

1. Soviet Submarines are WAAAY OP. They can 1 shot anything equal to their size, and they decimate larger units in just 3 hits. Plus, the splash radius murders clusters of units, making it even worse. On top of that, if you fire torpedoes back at them and they run away/disappear from sight, the damn projectile disappears, and then they can just turn around and 1 shot you. 1 Submarine should not be able to potentially solo an entire fleet of ships, that's bullshit. They need to have their damage cut down to about 1/3 of what it is now, and they need to deal reduced splash damage.

2. Where are the water transports? Will they be coming soon? They are badly needed in some maps.

3. The map Icy Floes, who made this map? No offense to the creator, but this map is awful. There is barely any money on it to get anywhere constructive, and there is a large island in the middle full of the map full of money that you cannot get to by any means. What is the purpose of putting an island full of money that you cannot get to other than to taunt you? You are better off filling it with shrubbery instead. This map needs a rework, bad.

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Lin Kuei Ominae
Seth


Joined: 16 Aug 2006
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2015 12:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

1. which submarines are you talking about? Submarine (the one with torpedoes) or Missile Submarine?
The normal torpedo submarine does indeed have a lot of firepower but
-it has very weak armor
-short range
-can't shoot anything else than ships (no AA, no AG)

Not sure what you mean with splash radius, since the torpedo hits only 1 target and has no area damage. Only the missile submarine has a bit area damage, but its firepower is quite low compared to Nod sea shadow or GDI/Allies Cruiser.

You can also place an MSA near shores to detect approaching submarines. Due to their short range and most other ships very long range, submarines will then have a hard time getting close enough to fire on your ships.

2. Tiberian Sun has no way to create water transports. The engine simply doesn't has any logic for this.
The only thing you can do is transport units with the helitrans, which is also a carryall.

3. Rampastring made the map (See in the client bottom right corner when you have a map selected).
Each player has 2 ore fields. more than enough to build up a nice fleet of ships. It's indeed not a lot of money, but having unlimited money would be boring as there is no economy handling then, just stupidly pumping out units. It's strategy and tactic, you know. Wink
If it's not enough money for you, then enable the "Infinite Tiberium/Ore" option.
You can bring an MCV with the helitrans (which is a carryall) over to the main island. Deploy there again and build refineries there. (but of course only if the other players let you build there and don't crush you with their ships Wink)

Valherran wrote:
This map needs a rework, bad.

no it doesn't.
You just have to learn the possibilities and tactics of DTA better. Wink

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Valherran
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Joined: 28 Feb 2010

PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2015 2:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Ah, so the Transport Helicopter is the all purpose Carryall of the game? Gotcha.

Quote:
1. which submarines are you talking about? Submarine (the one with torpedoes) or Missile Submarine?
The normal torpedo submarine does indeed have a lot of firepower but
-it has very weak armor
-short range
-can't shoot anything else than ships (no AA, no AG)

Not sure what you mean with splash radius, since the torpedo hits only 1 target and has no area damage. Only the missile submarine has a bit area damage, but its firepower is quite low compared to Nod sea shadow or GDI/Allies Cruiser.


Yes, I am talking about the normal Submarines, not the Missile Submarines. They may have weak armor, but the armor is irrelevant if they just 1 shot damn near everything in the ocean. And their range isn't that short, in fact it's about the same if not more than the 1st tier ships. It's a good thing they can't fire at anything else, otherwise they would be even more ridiculous.

They do have splash radius from what I saw. I had some units close together and I watched a 3rd of their life bar disappear in 1 attack after the primary target died.

@Bittah Commander: I discovered that if you shoot an idle Harvester by a shore line, it can potentially move into the ocean and cause it's pathing to be ocean only and move around freely in water.

Also, I noticed a strange movement speed burst that ground units sometimes get if they travel a long distance. I am not sure why this happens, but it's there. And before you ask, no, these units were not moving directly in a horizontal direction.

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Lin Kuei Ominae
Seth


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2015 2:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Weapon range
Soviet Submarine: 9
Nod Torpedo Boat: 7
GDI Gunboat: 11
Allies Destroyer: 10

So only the Nod torpedo boat has shorter range. An important advantage of all the ships is, that they have a turret and can shoot while moving (good micro management provided).
The submarine torpedos however have quite some trouble hitting moving targets, thus with good micro there is a good chance to kill submarines.
Later ships have much longer range and thus even less problems killing submarines (provided you detected them early enough)

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2015 3:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

In addition to using Ctrl+Alt to give your unit a moving fire order, you can also use Q-move. The difference of this is that it allows you to select what target your unit should fire at while moving and even allows your to force-fire while moving (which is useful if the submarines have already cloaked).
To Q-move, simply first give an attack order (or order your units to force-fire somewhere via Ctrl+click) and then, while holding "Q" on your keyboard, give your unit a move order. The unit will then keep attacking the selected target, while moving towards the location you ordered it to.
Valherran wrote:
I discovered that if you shoot an idle Harvester by a shore line, it can potentially move into the ocean and cause it's pathing to be ocean only and move around freely in water.

Did this happen to a human or AI-owned Harvester and did this happen on a specific map?
I can only imagine this happening with AI-owned harvesters on Icy Floes and Perilous Islands, in which case it's normal (it's an unavoidable side-effect of making the AI not build any war factories on those maps).
Valherran wrote:
Also, I noticed a strange movement speed burst that ground units sometimes get if they travel a long distance. I am not sure why this happens, but it's there. And before you ask, no, these units were not moving directly in a horizontal direction.

In enhanced mode, units without tracks have different movement speeds on different kinds of terrain. Tiberium will for example make those units move slower than normal, roads and pavement will make them move faster.

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Valherran
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2015 7:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Quote:
Did this happen to a human or AI-owned Harvester and did this happen on a specific map?
I can only imagine this happening with AI-owned harvesters on Icy Floes and Perilous Islands, in which case it's normal (it's an unavoidable side-effect of making the AI not build any war factories on those maps).


Happened with both, so far I have seen it happen on Icy Floes with my Harvester. Seen it happen on Stranded with the AI, and saw it happen with another player and AI on Circle of Death.

Quote:
In enhanced mode, units without tracks have different movement speeds on different kinds of terrain. Tiberium will for example make those units move slower than normal, roads and pavement will make them move faster.


Yeah I noticed that the enhanced mode alters the movement speed based on the terrain. But, I had a few Mammoth Tanks traveling on just grass, and out of nowhere they gained 20% more speed. And there was nothing out there at all, not even a crate while I watched this happen in plain sight. l also saw this occur with my Medium Tanks going across a plain of snow.

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Bittah Commander
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2015 3:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Valherran wrote:
Happened with both, so far I have seen it happen on Icy Floes with my Harvester. Seen it happen on Stranded with the AI, and saw it happen with another player and AI on Circle of Death.

Did you happen to have hijacked the AI's harvester when it happened to your harvester?
Although even then, the fact it happened to other players on different maps is strange. If there was tiberium accidentally placed on water, this could possibly happen, but I already confirmed this was neither the case on Stranded or Circle of Death.
Valherran wrote:
Yeah I noticed that the enhanced mode alters the movement speed based on the terrain. But, I had a few Mammoth Tanks traveling on just grass, and out of nowhere they gained 20% more speed. And there was nothing out there at all, not even a crate while I watched this happen in plain sight. l also saw this occur with my Medium Tanks going across a plain of snow.

Are you sure that it wasn't the game itself that sped up?
It of course might just be an already existent logic in the game that I never noticed before. For hovering units (in DTA that's currently only the TS Hover MLRS that you can get from crates) it's possible to change how much of a speed boost they get after traveling in a straight line for a while (it's currently set to 150%), but regular units don't have a setting for this.

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Valherran
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2015 6:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Quote:
Did you happen to have hijacked the AI's harvester when it happened to your harvester?
Although even then, the fact it happened to other players on different maps is strange. If there was tiberium accidentally placed on water, this could possibly happen, but I already confirmed this was neither the case on Stranded or Circle of Deat


Nope, didn't use anything special. It's rare that it happens though.

Quote:
Are you sure that it wasn't the game itself that sped up?
It of course might just be an already existent logic in the game that I never noticed before. For hovering units (in DTA that's currently only the TS Hover MLRS that you can get from crates) it's possible to change how much of a speed boost they get after traveling in a straight line for a while (it's currently set to 150%), but regular units don't have a setting for this.


Not sure why the game would just spontaneously speed up, I never mess with the speed settings regardless, I leave them at "Fast". So far it has happened only 4 times total. Once with Mammoth Tanks, once with Medium Tanks, once with V2 Rockets, and Once with Flame Tanks.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2015 2:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Depending on your system, the game can slow down a bit when there's a lot going on and when this happens online, this'll naturally slow down the game for all other players as well (this can also happen when the connection between the players just happens to be bad).
Once the game has slowed down, it can later on suddenly speed up again when the cause of the slowdown disappears.

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Valherran
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 4:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

So I did a little more playing...

After messing around with the advanced infantry, such as the Nod Cyborg, Tanya, Volkov and the GDI Commando, The GDI Commando is so outclassed by the others mentioned.

Cyborg is anti-ground, beats up tanks, instant kills infantry, lots of HP.

Tanya is anti infantry, she mows through infantry super fast and has C4 to insta-kill buildings.

Volkov is anti-ground, he is pretty much the Nod Cyborg except maybe slightly faster movement?

Then there is the GDI Commando... Who also has C4, but has a slower ROF than Tanya and has no other real perks present.

GDI sure gets shafted in the Commando department on Enhanced mode. If I were to buff him, he would have a much longer range to take out infantry and deal a reasonable amount to light armor when promoted (remove the grenade), then he would be pretty solid.

What do you guys think? If there is something I missed about these guys, let me know.

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^Rampastein
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 9:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

The Commando isn't meant to be equivalent to the Cyborg or Volkov. The Cyborg and Volkov are both the "epic" units of Nod and Soviet, while GDI has the XO Powersuit as their epic unit and the commando is just a weaker special unit. The commando is mainly meant for killing infantry (he's still pretty good at it) and blowing up bases with C4s if you manage to sneak in without your enemy detecting him quickly enough. Often it's possible to do a Chinook + Commando attack when the enemy is distracted and blow up half a dozen important structures. I've won online games that way.

Volkov is slightly weaker than the Cyborg but has higher speed and higher range. It's possible that he's too strong right now though.

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Lin Kuei Ominae
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 9:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Volkov and Cyborg have BuildLimit=1.
Tanya and Commando can be build 3 times.
Commando is also the cheapest with only 1000cr. So it's a lot easier to do a chinook attack with him.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 1:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

So his only perk is just being the cheapest to build... Still seems under par regardless. :-/

Quote:
The Commando isn't meant to be equivalent to the Cyborg or Volkov.


I never said he was.

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Valherran
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 22, 2015 10:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I did some playing around, and I like the new naval units, they make Naval combat much better.

My only complaint about it however, is the GDI Aircraft carrier. That thing BADLY needs a buff, its damage is just laughable and not worth the price tag. Both the bombers and the fighters need serious buffs to speed, damage, and range. The Aircraft Carrier also needs to be able to hold more planes, 1 for each deployed carrier is too little.

I also noticed that any aircraft can dock on it, which is nice in a sense, but also annoying when you expect your aircraft to return to the pad it came from and not a nearby Aircraft Carrier going through AA to land. If there is a way to make it so that non-fighters/bombers do not auto seek a nearby carrier to land on it, that would be very helpful.

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Lin Kuei Ominae
Seth


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 22, 2015 10:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

carriers have a long range and are excellent against bases.
-the drones can't be made faster due engine limitation
-carrier is using helipad logic, which can hold only 1 aircraft per building. nothing we can change. engine limitation.


The carrier is meant to support your planes/helis, so they don't have to fly back all the way over the map to your base.
They are supposed to give aircraft a quick reload near the enemy base.
If you don't want your aircraft to land on them, then simply keep them in mobile mode and don't deploy them. Wink

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 22, 2015 11:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Yeah, all the uber-range ships (Aircraft Carrier, Sea Shadow, Project 941 and the Cruiser) aren't really meant for destroying other naval units but for devastating bases, and they're all quite effective at it. They are still able to damage ships, and in large groups the damage can be significant, but for ship vs ship combat you primarily need to rely on the basic and radar-tier ships.

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Valherran
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2015 3:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I was using the Carriers against structures, and it took them a long time to kill them compared to the other ships that do the same job.

How is the drone speed an engine limitation?

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Lin Kuei Ominae
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2015 8:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

The drones that are fired as a weapon, need that exact speed to show the "runway" style start behaviour.
Faster and they vertically take off like a missile.
Due to their extreme firing range and homing capability, it's also no problem if they are slow. They just take a bit longer to hit, but finally they will hit.

The carrier drone that you can build is that slow, to
a) match the weapon drones
b) be ineffective in across the map attacks (this is supposed to be a short range attack drone)
c) prevent them from being overpowered, since with a fast speed they could shoot before being shot down by AA. And since they are so cheap, suicide attacks would be no problem for them.

Finally, it also doesn't matter when sending them against structures, since they don't run away. The carrier drones can also catch up easy any moving tank and ship.



DPS (damage per second) of the Carrier weapon drones is a bit higher than the mobile cruiser. Carrier has longer range, can deploy for good range MSA, can reload A10 near enemy base, build cheap carrier drones, has more hitpoints than cruiser.
Totally worth the price imo.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2015 9:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Well, just had few  naval wars games and sorry to say...
Aircraft Carrier is useless to make as it stands right now, too expensive and slow for its supporting roles.
Allied cruiser is better investment for 2000$

Best just focus in gunboats and missile cruisers as GDI as if you run into allied cruiser line...
Only saving grace then is missile cruisers and any exposed carriers can't do jack to retaliate against as damage is far too insignificant given the delay it takes deliver it, be it units or buildings.

Admittedly, the 'fake' drones can't be intercepted so this thing can never get too high damage and may frankly undermine the point of whole unit being forced in the mod given the limitations.

As for deploy mode, I'm not sure of its usefulness, might be more handy to make its built drones use maybe hunterseeker logic (or somehow area guard etc) so you can keep building them and they would auto-take off against targets, granted target choosing part is the less good part then... as building a 1 single drone and then selecting it everytime to give attack mission is frankly boring or using the select carriers again by box everytime you got new fighters docked.

Allied destroyer is too low damage in my experience with its deck cannons or frankly I don't know as subs are hardly hurt by it.

Might be good idea to introduce torpedo launcher defenses given DTA's naval increased focus...
Sadly even GDI gunboat outranges Adv. Guard Tower!!! and Obelisk is of course similarly outranged by navy so may want naval defenses as the land ones are proved useless or naval mode need them increased in range.

I played archipelago map, the spot 3 hovercraft is screwed up as infantry can't enter the hovercraft no matter what I do, I assume hovercraft isn't moved enough into land...

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Bittah Commander
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2015 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Just like any other C&C, DTA has a "rock, paper, scissors" balance system, which goes for the ships as well.
First tier ships (with exception of the Scarab Speedboat) are primarily to be used for direct naval combat (ship vs ship).

The second tier ships (available after building a radar) are support ships with less armor (aside from the Missile Sub) and more range. Support ships aren't meant for direct combat, but are supposed to attack from behind the cover of the first tier ships (Nod's first and second tier ships are exceptions here).

Capital ships (available after building a tech center) aren't meant to be used against other ships (given their immense weapon range, players would then do nothing but spamming these capital ships after all, while having no use for the other ships aside from a little anti-air support).
Capital ships are meant for destroying bases and they're quite good at it if you get them close enough, which makes the first and second tier ships invaluable for escorting them.

This way all buildable ships all have a purpose in any stage of the game, rather than making the first and second tier ships useless once you're able to spam the capital ships.

ApolloTD wrote:
I played archipelago map, the spot 3 hovercraft is screwed up as infantry can't enter the hovercraft no matter what I do, I assume hovercraft isn't moved enough into land...

You're right about that. I already fixed this yesterday, but I'll wait until a few more changes have been made before uploading a new update (it's far from a game-breaking issue after all).

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ApolloTD
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2015 12:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Bittah Commander wrote:
Capital ships (available after building a tech center) aren't meant to be used against other ships (given their immense weapon range, players would then do nothing but spamming these capital ships after all, while having no use for the other ships aside from a little anti-air support).


Tell that to the AI which spammed like 5-6 allied cruisers in a row and frankly shelled my navy fleet to some epic damage and my supporting lol carriers couldn't help nor flee particularly.

Needless to say, I lost that engagement and had to make all new fleet.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2015 1:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Yeah, the AI indeed produces ships quite fast (too fast), but you can even win a fight with only half the number of first tier ships of the amount of capital ships your opponent has (provided there's no other ships mixed in), so the player using capital ships for direct naval combat will lose a lot more credits.

When attacking the AI you just need to make sure to take out their naval yard ASAP, or the AI just might start producing new ships quicker than you can destroy them.

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Valherran
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2015 4:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Speaking of AI, they are building aircraft in packs of 3 at once, and I think the additional 2 from that pack are given to them for free. I had a Hard AI surrounded, he only had 1 harvester and refinery left, and when it built an aircraft it got 3 at once and they all came from off map.

Quote:
As for deploy mode, I'm not sure of its usefulness, might be more handy to make its built drones use maybe hunterseeker logic (or somehow area guard etc) so you can keep building them and they would auto-take off against targets, granted target choosing part is the less good part then...


That's a good idea, it would make them so much better.

And in all honesty, the drones should be immune to damage. 1 Bazooka infantry can practically thwart off a single carrier attack, it's depressing.

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^Rampastein
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2015 4:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

The AI aircraft "cloning" happens because they have multiple helipads / airfields. The AI pretty much plays with a C&C3-like sidebar, meaning that it gains an additional production queue for every factory of a specific type that it owns. This happens even in vanilla TS. I don't think they get the extra aircraft for free, however.

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Graion Dilach
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2015 4:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

They do get all cloned stuff for free.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2015 4:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

A few times I've seen the AI producing different units from different war factories when it has had multiple ones though, which makes me believe that the cloned stuff might not be free. I could of course be wrong though.

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Graion Dilach
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2015 5:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I know what you mean. The AI also benefits from MultipleFactory. The event you mean occurs when a WarFactory's exit gets clogged up and so vehicle kickout between WFs lose their sync - if the AI finished building a cheap unit just after an expensive one, a clone factory could easily kick out it's respective cheap clone while factory #1 kicks out expensive.

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Bittah Commander
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2015 8:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Valherran wrote:
And in all honesty, the drones should be immune to damage. 1 Bazooka infantry can practically thwart off a single carrier attack, it's depressing.

Then use the Carrier's default weapon to attack targets that have anti-air defenses nearby.

If the carrier's buildable drones were immune to damage, you'd be able to attack any target anywhere on the map without any difficulty. Don't forget you're not the only one who uses those drones; would you really think it'd be a good gameplay mechanic if an enemy player could just use those drones to take out any of your artillery or other lightly armored units from anywhere on the map at will, with there being nothing you can do to stop it? I didn't think so.

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Lin Kuei Ominae
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2015 8:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

not to speak of sending the immune drones in front of your A10s and Orcas, so the immune drone takes all the AA fire on it, while the A10s and Orcas do their job without any losses.


@Apollo: HunterSeeker drones are bad, since they
-don't follow the normal aircraft flight behaviour (they rotate instantly)
-they can only do suicide attacks
-the BuildLimit is ignored and instead used like a MaximumQueuedObjects setting just for this unit.

There is afaik no way to give aircraft some kind of auto-targeting like GuardRange.

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^Rampastein
Rampastring


Joined: 11 Oct 2008
Location: Gensokyo

PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2015 8:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I can imagine the carrier being quite clunky to use though as it is (I don't really have personal experience since I always used Nod/Allies/Soviet during our internal testing #Tongue ), so maybe some changes should be made. But let's give it a bit more time.

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Valherran
Soldier


Joined: 28 Feb 2010

PostPosted: Tue Feb 24, 2015 12:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Bittah Commander wrote:
Valherran wrote:
And in all honesty, the drones should be immune to damage. 1 Bazooka infantry can practically thwart off a single carrier attack, it's depressing.

Then use the Carrier's default weapon to attack targets that have anti-air defenses nearby.

If the carrier's buildable drones were immune to damage, you'd be able to attack any target anywhere on the map without any difficulty. Don't forget you're not the only one who uses those drones; would you really think it'd be a good gameplay mechanic if an enemy player could just use those drones to take out any of your artillery or other lightly armored units from anywhere on the map at will, with there being nothing you can do to stop it? I didn't think so.


Oh whoops, wrong unit, I thought the bomber drones could be shot down too, never mind.

One thing is for certain though, the damage of both the drones need to be increased.

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Valherran
Soldier


Joined: 28 Feb 2010

PostPosted: Tue Feb 24, 2015 3:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Word of advice, make sure a GDI Runway is NOT the last production building left, otherwise this happens. Also the AI built about 8 Runways and did NOT have a cap on A-10 production, and the amount of aircraft seen in this picture tripled by the time I got the necessary units to take him down, it lagged like hell too. Lastly, he had no Harvesters, the planes were being built for free 4-8 at a time.



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ApolloTD
Commander


Joined: 19 Nov 2003

PostPosted: Tue Feb 24, 2015 6:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Ah looks like LKO forgot entirely about naval yards (or somebody who changed naval yards to wood from concrete...) with the 'missile' plane carrier weapon as frankly they don't take damage particularly at all (only debris vs wood which is nulled in water) and particle only handles ships.

Burst=4 launcher actually makes the basic form carrier useful but deployed form is still rather unhelpful... I would propose some air fuel bomb plane for it since suicide drones are no go then again basic form suicides the planes too as they vanish...

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Valherran
Soldier


Joined: 28 Feb 2010

PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2015 1:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Found another problem, the "Experimental Lab" map causes all AI factions to mass produce Hover MLRS.



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Valherran
Soldier


Joined: 28 Feb 2010

PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2015 11:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Found another oddity, Soviet AI can sometimes build up to 3 Volkovs.

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Lin Kuei Ominae
Seth


Joined: 16 Aug 2006
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2015 12:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Valherran wrote:
Found another oddity, Soviet AI can sometimes build up to 3 Volkovs.

That can't be prevented. The AI does not follow any BuildLimit and thus can build hero units more than the limit.
engine limitation.

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Public SHPs
X-Mech Calendar (28 Mechs for GDI and Nod)
5 GDI, 5 Nod, 1 Mutant, 1 Scrin unit, 1 GDI building

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^Rampastein
Rampastring


Joined: 11 Oct 2008
Location: Gensokyo

PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2015 7:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

The issue in the Experiment Lab should be fixed now btw; thanks for reporting it.

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