Project Perfect Mod Forums
:: Home :: Get Hosted :: PPM FAQ :: Forum FAQ :: Privacy Policy :: Search :: Memberlist :: Usergroups :: Register :: Profile :: Log in to check your private messages :: Log in ::


The time now is Thu Mar 28, 2024 11:34 am
All times are UTC + 0
Ares Logic Suggestions
Moderators: Ares Support Team at PPM, Global Moderators, Red Alert 2 Moderators
Post new topic   Reply to topic Page 1 of 1 [19 Posts] Mark the topic unread ::  View previous topic :: View next topic
Author Message
PussyPus
Commander


Joined: 14 Jul 2015
Location: Egypt

PostPosted: Thu May 18, 2017 11:32 am    Post subject:  Ares Logic Suggestions
Subject description: Do we need another mode?
Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hi, it's my first time to start my own topic for suggesting new ares logics, here are what i want to suggest for:

1st: The 'Renegade' Mode, it should have the following content:
1. begin game with mcv, and build buildings, those buildings costs should be cut by 50% in this mode only.
2. force resolution to the lowest (640x480).
3. disallowed map control (mini map active normally but can't control units from there).
4. entire tanya, boris and yuri prime can be built after infiltrating battle labs, depending on what faction you chose.
5. any unit should be followed by the screen like pressing 'F' on any objects, but permanently.
6. you can make a unit or a building to work as AI mode as you desire by adding new control hotkey.

2nd: Logics Not Supported By Ares Yet like:
1. Tunnel Network
2. Movable BuildingType
3. Tertiary Weapon (there are Primary and Secondary i think)
4. BuildingType Deploys into Different Versions & Purposes with a building animation.

They might not be possible but in the future it will.

_________________
If you are a MetalHead (Heavy Metal Fan) and don't want to be a metalhead, Just remove your metal ball from your head. �:p .

Last edited by PussyPus on Thu May 18, 2017 8:09 pm; edited 2 times in total

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message ModDB Profile ID Skype Account
NucleiSplitter
Laser Commando


Also Known As: martx
Joined: 28 Oct 2016
Location: PH

PostPosted: Thu May 18, 2017 1:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Tertiary Weapons are possible! But it's pretty complex for newcomers in modding, so you should've just stated a 'Tertiary=' tag, but that is a nice idea though...

Renegade mode? Is that like C&C Renegade in Westwood 2D Engine?
Well, not a bad idea, custom coding is required, I don't see how it's possible in Ares 0.Cp1

Movable BuildingTypes? Why not just create a vehicle that transforms into a building?
(e.g. Slave Miner, except it's artwork is a shp that has 8 facings)

Ever heard of Terrain Expansion?

And one last thing, if this thread is for public opinions...
The Feature I'd really like in RA2/YR, is that the last Death Frame of an infantry would be used if it dies instead of the decaying bones and be kept on the map, but the flame-death and shock-death should be kept so that the normal artwork lf the infantry dosen't necessarily have to be edited, when the infantry died of electricution, it should have the normal flame-death and shock-death and it won't be kept in the map showing it's last frame of death. Basically a Realistic Death using a tag in the [General] section called 'RealisticDeath=' defaults to no

_________________
all my posts before 2020 were made by a 13 year-old, forgive these if you see any, thank you

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Starkku
Cyborg Commando


Joined: 28 Dec 2007
Location: Finland

PostPosted: Thu May 18, 2017 2:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

You know you can override the decaying skeletons animations on per infantry basis by listing DeadBodies on InfantryTypes?

_________________

Last edited by Starkku on Thu May 18, 2017 4:54 pm; edited 1 time in total

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website ModDB Profile ID Twitter Channel URL
chr0nicz420
Jumpjet Infantry


Joined: 10 Feb 2016

PostPosted: Thu May 18, 2017 4:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Even though I believe this idea was rejected before:

- Overlord logic.

And I'll still be wishing for this until this has been implemented.

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
TAK02
General


Joined: 28 Jun 2015
Location: It was Damascus.

PostPosted: Thu May 18, 2017 5:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Oh, you mean expandable pop-caps like in SC for the Zerg! Unfortunatly, C&C games that aren't C&C4 or later use a simple principle regarding that: "Can you afford this unit/building?" "Yes." "BUILDING...". So, it's unrecodable hard-coding, really. But if it were possible, it would've been made an option.
Why non-C&C games never used that and instead opted for both an expandable pop-cap AND resource-collection is beyond me.
The closest one could get to your idea is using a collective BuildLimit which applies to all units, but then it wouldn't be expandable without creating replicas of, well, everything, which in turn has its own BuildLimit for those, which may or may not exceed the originals'...
Maybe some combo of both BuildLimit and GroupAs logics?

_________________
One and only developer of the Command & Conquer Dune "C&C D" mod.
m7 wrote:
I tend to release things I create so that assets are never lost to hard drive problems, accidental deletion, or me having to pretend to care about rippers taking things from my project when it is done. #Tongue

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website ModDB Profile ID YouTube User URL Twitter Channel URL Skype Account
PussyPus
Commander


Joined: 14 Jul 2015
Location: Egypt

PostPosted: Fri May 19, 2017 6:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I focus on Renegade Mode, Turtle Mode and Tunnel Network logic.

_________________
If you are a MetalHead (Heavy Metal Fan) and don't want to be a metalhead, Just remove your metal ball from your head. �:p .

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message ModDB Profile ID Skype Account
temp
Rocket Cyborg


Joined: 17 Oct 2015

PostPosted: Fri May 19, 2017 9:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Ares Devs aren't magicians...

_________________
Lin Kuei Ominae wrote:
@Pussypus Talking to a wall is more fertile. Face palm!  Wall bash!

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mevitar
Missile Trooper


Joined: 31 Dec 2010

PostPosted: Fri May 19, 2017 11:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Alex' work isn't about implement gamemodes. Its about giving new tools so modders can create gamemodes themselves.

This Renegade Mode you mention is a game mode, not a tool. So i can already tell you that it won't happen.

Or, actually, it might happen, but only if you make it yourself. YR+Ares already provides plenty of tools to have such mode created.

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
PussyPus
Commander


Joined: 14 Jul 2015
Location: Egypt

PostPosted: Sat May 20, 2017 1:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

temp wrote:
Ares Devs aren't magicians...


Temp's comeback!  Surprised

_________________
If you are a MetalHead (Heavy Metal Fan) and don't want to be a metalhead, Just remove your metal ball from your head. �:p .

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message ModDB Profile ID Skype Account
temp
Rocket Cyborg


Joined: 17 Oct 2015

PostPosted: Sat May 20, 2017 11:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

PussyPus wrote:
temp wrote:
Ares Devs aren't magicians...


Temp's comeback!  Surprised


I am Zlixine.

_________________
Lin Kuei Ominae wrote:
@Pussypus Talking to a wall is more fertile. Face palm!  Wall bash!

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
PussyPus
Commander


Joined: 14 Jul 2015
Location: Egypt

PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2017 8:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

temp wrote:
PussyPus wrote:
temp wrote:
Ares Devs aren't magicians...


Temp's comeback!  Surprised


I am Zlixine.


I know already, more things happened and you missed them since you were inactive, so i think you are back for your mod right?

_________________
If you are a MetalHead (Heavy Metal Fan) and don't want to be a metalhead, Just remove your metal ball from your head. �:p .

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message ModDB Profile ID Skype Account
temp
Rocket Cyborg


Joined: 17 Oct 2015

PostPosted: Fri May 26, 2017 11:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

PussyPus wrote:
temp wrote:
PussyPus wrote:
temp wrote:
Ares Devs aren't magicians...


Temp's comeback!  Surprised


I am Zlixine.


I know already, more things happened and you missed them since you were inactive, so i think you are back for your mod right?


Nope.

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Millennium
Commander


Joined: 09 Mar 2008
Location: Osaka (JP)/Hong Kong/Germany

PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

A few thoughts:
PussyPus wrote:

1st: The 'Renegade' Mode, it should have the following content:
1. begin game with mcv, and build buildings, those buildings costs should be cut by 50% in this mode only.
4. entire tanya, boris and yuri prime can be built after infiltrating battle labs, depending on what faction you chose.

Why would this require any modifications to the EXE?

Quote:

6. you can make a unit or a building to work as AI mode as you desire by adding new control hotkey.

This would, I concede, be immensely interesting. However, it is very generally reducible to the unit "stances" found in many other RTS games (AoE, Cossacks, Command & Conquer: Generals). While the YR UI doesn't support a visual interface for switching unit AI stances beyond AreaGuard and AttackMove (does this even work?), I could imagine that this could be expanded to include other missions. As for a unit chosing its mission by itself, I don't see that that will be possible.

Quote:

2. Movable BuildingType

Also agreed, though at some point, one has to ask what even constitutes the difference between the subtypes of the TechnoTypes, beyond the game engine's ontology. What would moveable buildings be good for? Perhaps the relevant building tags can instead be given to vehicles as an easier route. With suggestions like moveable BuildingTypes, VehicleTypes that can function as Factory and allowing units to occupy more than one cell, one has already greatly blurred the distinction between buildings and vehicles.

Quote:

3. Tertiary Weapon (there are Primary and Secondary i think)

There have long been requests for additional weapons, beyond three. This feature would most likely be implemented via the "WeaponN" tag.

Quote:

4. BuildingType Deploys into Different Versions & Purposes with a building animation.

Agreed, but in a more generalized form of enabling principally all TechnoType-to-TechnoType (or, hey, TechnoType-to-ObjectType) transitions.

TAK02 wrote:
Oh, you mean expandable pop-caps like in SC for the Zerg! Unfortunatly, C&C games that aren't C&C4 or later use a simple principle regarding that: "Can you afford this unit/building?" "Yes." "BUILDING...". So, it's unrecodable hard-coding, really. But if it were possible, it would've been made an option.
Why non-C&C games never used that and instead opted for both an expandable pop-cap AND resource-collection is beyond me.


Here is an interesting article I read ages ago on the rationale behind population caps in RTS:
http://www.rakrent.com/rtsc/html/econo4.htm
It seems that there are two considerations, one being to reduce workload on the machine the game is running on by reducing the number of units it has to simulate, the other accounts for that too, but also for the cases where that limit is expandable: it is merely a design choice for realistic-simulation purposes. (Of course, both the fixed "hard cap" and transgressable "sub-caps" can occur together in games - they do for example in StarCraft.) Given the era it was produced in, I find it actually more remarkable that C&C's designers never opted to introduce popcaps.

Quote:

The closest one could get to your idea is using a collective BuildLimit which applies to all units, but then it wouldn't be expandable without creating replicas of, well, everything, which in turn has its own BuildLimit for those, which may or may not exceed the originals'...
Maybe some combo of both BuildLimit and GroupAs logics?

Well, Ares already fixed the issue of buildings not counting towards the BuildLimit of the vehicle they deploy from (and vice versa) and the DeploysInto relation seems to be closely tied to the Select module that GroupAs works with. I am somewhat confident that GroupAs can be expanded to communicate its contents to the BuildLimit module. Of course, if one would also like to have actual per-unit BuildLimits in addition to a holistic BuildLimit, then GroupAs would have to be modified to take a list, rather than a string. (And doing that would allow for anything in-between the two: e.g. you may build 100 units in total, not more than 20 of which may be tanks, but of those tanks you may only build 1 Mammoth Tank. Now, making different units count at different values towards a popcap - that is a wholly different kind of beast and not one I can see Ares tackling.)
As for the expandable popcap: right now, that would require copies (perhaps several) of every unit, yes. But I can see the potential for a "AlterBuildLimit="-esque tag, accepting, in some form, a GroupAs group and a number by which to raise (or lower?) the BuildLimit of that group.

On that note, a question concerning a more humble feature request:
is it planned to introduce additional Veterancy levels or ColorAdd for warheads?

Edit:
On a second thought: In a sense, C&C _has_ a popcap in the sense of the logistics-simulation rationale spoken about in the article, although it does not prevent construction and applies only to buildings - and that is the Power system. Now, different BuildingTypes count for and against that resource at different rates (i.e. the Power= tag), which fulfills another criterion of a flexible popcap system. If Power was expanded to allow other types and to prevent the construction of units if it was insufficient (or produce them Unpowered, like a PoweredBy unit, rendering them useless and hence unlikely to be built by rational player when Power is too low), that could emulate a popcap. If that system could even be extended to provide an expansive list of "Power-like" resources to be implemented in the game, it would be possible to create a fine-grained popcap system...

_________________
Mao Zedong wrote:

Our mission, unfinished, may take a thousand years.  

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
PussyPus
Commander


Joined: 14 Jul 2015
Location: Egypt

PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 7:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

The number 4 for example the tesla reactor from the cancelled turtle mode, you can change the form of the buildingtype.

_________________
If you are a MetalHead (Heavy Metal Fan) and don't want to be a metalhead, Just remove your metal ball from your head. �:p .

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message ModDB Profile ID Skype Account
4StarGeneral
General


Joined: 14 Sep 2006
Location: Limbo

PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 8:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

If you want to change the form (read visuals + weapon) it can be done via the [BuildingType]?Upgrades= system. In all practicality this can now all be done with some moderate level modding (except for 5 and 6 because why?).
The only thing that can't be done is moving a buildingtype and there's a good reason for that as it would not be able to override terrain and 50,000 other things. If this were not a grid-based structure placement game and instead something like Generals and above, then it would actually be doable.

_________________
"Don't beg for things; Do it yourself or you'll never get anything."

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail YouTube User URL
Millennium
Commander


Joined: 09 Mar 2008
Location: Osaka (JP)/Hong Kong/Germany

PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 9:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Which is why I think that it's a more feasible route to make some building tags valid for VehicleTypes instead. Probably, the things people would want a mobile building to be would be a refinery, a factory - both could be stuck on vehicle types. I don't think upgrades can be made to work on vehicles though without a really deep rewrite.

Edit: typo

_________________
Mao Zedong wrote:

Our mission, unfinished, may take a thousand years.  

Last edited by Millennium on Tue Jul 25, 2017 7:42 am; edited 1 time in total

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Atomic_Noodles
Defense Minister


Joined: 05 Oct 2011

PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 2:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

On the opposite end of wanting Vehicle Tags on Buildings I'm still interested on a Gunner Logic being also applicable to buildings.

_________________
~ Excelsior ~

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
TAK02
General


Joined: 28 Jun 2015
Location: It was Damascus.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 6:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Question: Is it possible for Ares to store Globals? IIRC, RA2 didn't carry their Clear/Set states continuously, always forgetting them when making Auto-Saves.

I thought of storing said Globals' state in a seperate file/INI. Said Globals only change through map-triggers, not when the game saves/closes. (Yes, I know it sounds similar to a certain game's logic, but please don't spoil it's name here, would you? #Tongue)

Is that possible?

_________________
One and only developer of the Command & Conquer Dune "C&C D" mod.
m7 wrote:
I tend to release things I create so that assets are never lost to hard drive problems, accidental deletion, or me having to pretend to care about rippers taking things from my project when it is done. #Tongue

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website ModDB Profile ID YouTube User URL Twitter Channel URL Skype Account
Millennium
Commander


Joined: 09 Mar 2008
Location: Osaka (JP)/Hong Kong/Germany

PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 12:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Atomic_Noodles wrote:
On the opposite end of wanting Vehicle Tags on Buildings I'm still interested on a Gunner Logic being also applicable to buildings.

Seconded that. Smile I want to re-create WH40K's Tau Drone Sentry Turrets.

_________________
Mao Zedong wrote:

Our mission, unfinished, may take a thousand years.  

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic Page 1 of 1 [19 Posts] Mark the topic unread ::  View previous topic :: View next topic
 
Share on TwitterShare on FacebookShare on Google+Share on DiggShare on RedditShare on PInterestShare on Del.icio.usShare on Stumble Upon
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum


Powered by phpBB © phpBB Group

[ Time: 0.1849s ][ Queries: 11 (0.0085s) ][ Debug on ]