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Academy building and veteran cameos
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Kou
Civilian


Joined: 18 Jul 2018
Location: Shanghai, China

PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 3:20 pm    Post subject:  Academy building and veteran cameos
Subject description: Units start veteran after academy building captured, but no veteran cameos even with SHP files
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I made the Tech Outpost a academy building to train aircrafts that start veteran, which actully worked. However, the cameos failed to gain the veteran symbols even though the "AltCameo=" was set in artmd.ini. The corresponding .shp files of veteran cameos were already added in the game folder. Is there any way to enable the veteran cameos?

Say train Black Eagle starts veteran (so do other aircrafts) with Tech Outpost captured.

Code:

[CAOUTP] ; appended to rulesmd.ini
Academy.AircraftVeterancy=1.0  ; Ares 0.8

[BEAG] ; appended to artmd.ini
AltCameo=BEAGUICO ; BEAGICON with veteran symbol

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Speeder
Commander


Joined: 03 Sep 2004
Location: Czechia

PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 3:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Academy doesn't make veteran cameos appear, only Spy Effect does.

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Kou
Civilian


Joined: 18 Jul 2018
Location: Shanghai, China

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 1:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Speeder wrote:
Academy doesn't make veteran cameos appear, only Spy Effect does.


Is it considered a minor bug for Academy buildings? If not, why?

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MRMIdAS
Energy Commando


Joined: 17 Jul 2008

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 2:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I agree, academy should change cameos too.

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AlexB
Commander


Joined: 31 May 2010
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 6:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Only when a unit is constructed, the veterancy is applied. This applies to VeteranInfantry and friends, Spy effects, and Academies.

For the former ones, it is clear for each object whether it will become veteran or not: VeteranInfantry checks whether the infantry being build is contained in the list; Spy Effects check whether they are activated or not. Both of these are easily tested.

Academies however are not as easily checkable: All Academy buildings a player owns would have to be tested whether they apply to a unit type, and also to what degree: Academies can make units halfway veteran, in which only two or more of those would enable veteran cameos. Worse, Academies support creating elite units, for which there wouldn't be any special cameos. This is slow, because it would have to be checked every time a cameo is drawn, for each cameo, all the time.

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MRMIdAS
Energy Commando


Joined: 17 Jul 2008

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 7:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

good point.

Fair enough too, if it's too slow, it's not really worth it.

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cxtian39
Commander


Joined: 11 Feb 2016

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 7:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

For consistency purpose you can disable all veteran cameo

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BaRaka
Medic


Joined: 09 Jun 2014

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 10:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

… or you can clone the units, give them the upgraded cameos, and then play with Prerequisite= and Prerequisite.Negative= to disable the real planes and allow you to build only the clones once you have the academy.

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cxtian39
Commander


Joined: 11 Feb 2016

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 10:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

BaRaka wrote:
… or you can clone the units, give them the upgraded cameos, and then play with Prerequisite= and Prerequisite.Negative= to disable the real planes and allow you to build only the clones once you have the academy.
I don't prefer that because that will interrupt building queues: the old one being built disappears and you need to rebuild the new one
If Ares can find a way to resolve this it will be great
Something like this:
APOC->SomeTag=APOCV
APOCV->SomeTag=APOC
If APOC is being built at 50% but its Prerequisite is no longer satisfied but APOCV's Prerequisite is satisfied, then APOCV is automatically being built at 50% and continues and any later order of APOCs all become APOCVs
Same for APOCV w/r/t APOC

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4StarGeneral
General


Joined: 14 Sep 2006
Location: Limbo

PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2018 12:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

One could argue that's a QoL thing and wasn't meant for Academies to function that way.

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Kou
Civilian


Joined: 18 Jul 2018
Location: Shanghai, China

PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2018 7:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

AlexB wrote:
Only when a unit is constructed, the veterancy is applied. This applies to VeteranInfantry and friends, Spy effects, and Academies.

For the former ones, it is clear for each object whether it will become veteran or not: VeteranInfantry checks whether the infantry being build is contained in the list; Spy Effects check whether they are activated or not. Both of these are easily tested.

Academies however are not as easily checkable: All Academy buildings a player owns would have to be tested whether they apply to a unit type, and also to what degree: Academies can make units halfway veteran, in which only two or more of those would enable veteran cameos. Worse, Academies support creating elite units, for which there wouldn't be any special cameos. This is slow, because it would have to be checked every time a cameo is drawn, for each cameo, all the time.


Alright is it possible to make aircrafts and naval vehicles start veteran through Spy Effects in future version?

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AlexB
Commander


Joined: 31 May 2010
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Mon Jul 23, 2018 5:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I added Naval, Aircraft, and Building Veterancy Spy Effects in the latest testing build.

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