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New C&C Remasters sidebar has been announced!
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Banshee
Supreme Banshee


Joined: 15 Aug 2002
Location: Brazil

PostPosted: Thu Jun 06, 2019 2:40 pm    Post subject:  New C&C Remasters sidebar has been announced!
Subject description: Nuclear warhead tab approaching!
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Yesterday, Jim Vessella, the producer of the upcoming remasters of Command & Conquer Tiberian Dawn and Red Alert 1 has shared some bits on their progress with the sidebar of the game. His main objective is to reduce scrolling from the player. So, here are his words on it, as posted on reddit:

Quote:
ellow Command & Conquer fans,

We have concluded our Pre-production phase and are now formally into Production. The art team at Lemon Sky is in full swing creating 4k content, and Petroglyph is continuing to stand up more features every week. Multiplayer is now playable for Tiberian Dawn, and we even had a chance to show the software to the Community Council a few weeks ago. Overall this transition into Production is a big milestone for any project, and we’ve been humbled by all the support thus far.

For this post, we wanted to share our approach to the in-game UI, and provide a sneak peek to our current in-progress version. Back when we announced the game in November, the UI was one of the key areas many of you in the community had passionate discussions about. As such, we listened to your videos, read comments from across the sites, and brainstormed with the Community Council. The trend we heard is that you still wanted the classic C&C Sidebar UI, but would welcome updates to the legacy UI to help the usability experience.

So with that in mind, one of the most requested improvements was to reduce the need for scrolling the Sidebar as much as possible. A key suggestion on how to accomplish this was to introduce the build tabs from Red Alert 2 and Tiberium Wars into the classic UI. We have thus decided to embrace this suggestion, and you can see the build tabs present in the associated preview image. However, because of the construction queue rules of the original games, we wanted to keep all buildings under a single tab, with associated tabs for Infantry, Vehicles (Air, Land, Naval), and Support Powers. To further support the goal of reduced scrolling, we have then designed the Sidebar to fit 18 build buttons. The combination of these elements means you’ll need to scroll much less, and along the way will benefit from many of the modern feedback elements of more recent C&C titles.

In terms of cosmetic design, we wanted the UI to follow our overall project direction of keeping elements authentic to the legacy version. We’ve done our best to capture the visual spirit of Tiberian Dawn, and or course would embrace a similar approach for Red Alert. We are recreating the build buttons in the spirit of the Gold Edition style, and again aiming to keep these as authentic as possible to the original design while preparing them for a 4k experience. Other updates include replacing the Repair, Sell, and Map buttons for icons to support our eventual localization efforts. And we’ve also shifted the Money and Options sections to above the radar map to ensure optimal screen allocation for the battlefield. All of these changes are done in the aspiration of keeping the spirit of the legacy Sidebar, while optimizing for a modern RTS gameplay experience.

Given the ongoing amount of passion around this UI topic, we are certainly eager to hear your thoughts in the comments, and looking forward to making the best UI experience possible for C&C Remastered.

Cheers,

Jim Vessella

Jimtern


And here's the sidebar, click on it to see it in its full glory:



Key Words: #News #CommandAndConquer #CommandAndConquerRemastered 

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PussyPus
Commander


Joined: 14 Jul 2015
Location: Underground Clone City

PostPosted: Thu Jun 06, 2019 3:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I always wonder, how would we be able to play it online after GameSpy and Westwood On-Line were defunkt?

@Banshee OMG, cameos are the best overall in this image, they remind me a lot of Mental Omega, Red-Resurrection and Project Phantom!
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Mechacaseal
Rocket Cyborg


Joined: 29 Aug 2015

PostPosted: Thu Jun 06, 2019 10:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
However, because of the construction queue rules of the original games, we wanted to keep all buildings under a single tab, with associated tabs for Infantry, Vehicles (Air, Land, Naval), and Support Powers.


Have to build each unit one at a time? I'm guessing the pathfinding bugs will also be in this game where units stop moving if another unit gets in its way or decides to turn around and take the long path instead of waiting etc? I'm gonna pass on this. I look forward to seeing the first ingame screenshots and video but if its really just like the original I'm not gonna be happy.

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Banshee
Supreme Banshee


Joined: 15 Aug 2002
Location: Brazil

PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2019 12:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Moving support powers to its own tab the sidebar wasn't a good deal at all. Unlike infantry and vehicles, it is critical that the player knows whenever he is able to launch a support power or how long does it take. And what they've done was to force the user to take longer to get this information and use these support powers, interfering on its ability to build constructions and manage units/vehicles that are being built.

If the idea is to reduce pollution on the part of the screen where the player view the battlefield, they could have added the support powers  together with repair/sell buttons, moving the display minimap button near the money information. What do we have in terms of support power for the first game? Air strike and superweapons? Considering that both can't be duplicated...  it wouldn't even reduce the amount of cameo slots in the sidebar.

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Mechacaseal
Rocket Cyborg


Joined: 29 Aug 2015

PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2019 1:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Banshee wrote:
Moving support powers to its own tab the sidebar wasn't a good deal at all. Unlike infantry and vehicles, it is critical that the player knows whenever he is able to launch a support power or how long does it take. And what they've done was to force the user to take longer to get this information and use these support powers, interfering on its ability to build constructions and manage units/vehicles that are being built.

If the idea is to reduce pollution on the part of the screen where the player view the battlefield, they could have added the support powers  together with repair/sell buttons, moving the display minimap button near the money information. What do we have in terms of support power for the first game? Air strike and superweapons? Considering that both can't be duplicated...  it wouldn't even reduce the amount of cameo slots in the sidebar.


i aint buying this shiat. they need to do more than a "remaster" of the graphics.


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ReFlex
Disk Thrower


Joined: 18 Jul 2006
Location: Austria

PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2019 10:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This sidebar is a huge waste of space, 1/5 of the screen only UI.
And it looks extremely cheap.
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Lin Kuei Ominae
Seth


Joined: 16 Aug 2006
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2019 10:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ReFlex wrote:
This sidebar is a huge waste of space, 1/5 of the screen only UI.
And it looks extremely cheap.

Well it looks true to the original, no problem there. And the original had even 1/3rd of the screen as sidemenu.

However, TD doesn't have that many build options in the first place to legitimate such a big sidemenu with that many categories.
When you have more than 4 rows of cameos under each other, you can get all that you ever need on it without having to scroll up/down.

Even in TD with only 8 cameos total, i had almost all i need visible
:infantry
-commando
-airstrike
-ion cannon
-mammoth

:vehicles
:aircraft
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Atomic_Noodles
Defense Minister


Joined: 05 Oct 2011

PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2019 1:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Triple Cameo layout seems fine for me imho. Tib Wars & RA3 did it and it looks fine and also its pretty much a good idea for utilizing the extra screen space. Something similar to Generals upward style of having the superweapons/support powers available from the left side seems like the best mix of old and classic GUI. As for the sidebar I'd go with the layout of RA2 with Buildings - Defenses - Infantry - Vehicles
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^Rampastein
Rampastring


Joined: 11 Oct 2008
Location: Gensokyo

PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2019 2:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Overall I really like it. Implementing categories but no extra defense queue is just the right amount of modernization.

+ It looks true to the original
+ The cameos are really beautiful
+ The large radar screen is nice
+ Categories are an improvement over TD

I really hope that it has category hotkeys, including a quick building placement hotkey like in RA2/YR and CnCNet TS.

I also think there's some things to improve, however.

- As Banshee pointed out, superweapons shouldn't be in their own category. You want to be able to see their timer at all times. Having the SWs in the left edge of the screen like in C&C3 would be preferable.
- There's needlessly many icons slots for Tiberian Dawn. Even with the Adv. PP, Adv. Guard Tower, both Comm. Centers and Concrete walls added in, there's still 5 building cameo slots unused. They could remove one row of cameos and use that to either make the sidebar smaller (so it'd reduce less of the viewable area), or add an extra display for the superweapons. Removing a column would also be an option, the 2-column sidebar in Red Alert 2 works very well.
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TAK02
Commander


Joined: 28 Jun 2015
Location: It was Damascus.

PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2019 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Atomic_Noodles wrote:
As for the sidebar I'd go with the layout of RA2 with Buildings - Defenses - Infantry - Vehicles

To keep the TD and RA1 logic/aesthetic where only one building could be built at a time, the defense tab would have to be swapped/reworked for a SW tab.

Considering the popular Mental Omega (and quite a few mods that I've seen) already (ab-)uses the defense tab somewhat with their own powers, I don't think many will find it too strange that they have powers as defenses (makes sense for some powers too).
Think of setting all BuildCat=defense buildings to BuildCat=resource or something.

Personally, the RA2 sidebar was the best, even in that it only had two cameos per row. And the 4 tabs.

EDIT: as others have stated, the SWs selectable/viewable like in the 3D C&Cs is necessary. Or maybe just going with RA2's bottom-right countdowns ...

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Graion Dilach
Defense Minister


Joined: 22 Nov 2010
Location: Iszkaszentgyörgy, Hungary

PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2019 3:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's an inconsistent mess. The UI elements coming from Petroglyph are chiseled, and taht other studio provides the cameos which have RA2 styled gloss buttons.
TD/RA1 also had chisel cameos.

The cameo font choice is uninspired. There's no shading on it either which makes the text unreadable on light background, as the Refinery cameo is willing to showcase.

The fact that you can't even say bad about it is lolz. This is obviously cheap compared to all the hype it receives.
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Mechacaseal
Rocket Cyborg


Joined: 29 Aug 2015

PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2019 5:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Graion Dilach wrote:
It's an inconsistent mess. The UI elements coming from Petroglyph are chiseled, and taht other studio provides the cameos which have RA2 styled gloss buttons.
TD/RA1 also had chisel cameos.

The cameo font choice is uninspired. There's no shading on it either which makes the text unreadable on light background, as the Refinery cameo is willing to showcase.

The fact that you can't even say bad about it is lolz. This is obviously cheap compared to all the hype it receives.


This is what happens when you spend all your time making shitty C&C mods. You notice things like this. There is definitely two conflicting art styles like you said and yes the refinery text is hard to read and yes a lot of the graphics look low budget like something that would come from ppmsite. and yes ppmsite makes shit mods just like this remaster. lets all be jelly they get paid to make a shitty tiberian dawn mod that in all honesty is going to be better than anything that has ever been churned out on this shitty website in the past 2 decades.

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Volgin
Commander


Joined: 07 Mar 2009

PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2019 5:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mechacaseal ain't wrong tho lol
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Yowza
Vehicle Driver


Joined: 11 Aug 2006
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2019 12:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One of my biggest worries about all this is if they go overboard with the designs and make them a bit too futuristic or overdetailed.

Both the interface and the buildings should preferably look like something built with a 90s techbase. Something that would fit in a 90s technological environment.

Edit: I just realized that the pic is huge and offers a good, close look at each of the icons.

I admit I feel similar as discussed in regards to the busy and emphasized details/overly stylized design - most notably on the powerplant. Though reflecting on it, it might also because it reminds me of that web-based C&C game. The designs overall look really cool and I especially like how simple and brutal they made the guard tower.

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cxtian39
Commander


Joined: 11 Feb 2016
Location: United States

PostPosted: Thu Jun 20, 2019 7:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How does the radar open

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TAK02
Commander


Joined: 28 Jun 2015
Location: It was Damascus.

PostPosted: Thu Jun 20, 2019 7:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cxtian39 wrote:
How does the radar open

That happens only in TibSun...

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Surgeon
Civilian


Joined: 04 Oct 2018

PostPosted: Fri Jun 21, 2019 6:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

1995 credits, what are the odds #Tongue

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djohe
Cyborg Artillery


Joined: 07 May 2006
Location: Sweden, Gothenburg

PostPosted: Sun Jul 07, 2019 10:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I do find it somewhat questionable too with how they did the sidebar, one solution would kinda be how C&C1 for PS1 & Saturn & N64 did it but at the same time I can understand why they did not do that.
Altho having SWs at the bottom kinda like Saturn/PS1/N64 could have partially solved the issue (or anywhere else on the screen like cough Generals cough).
If I understand this properly they also removed the ability to open/close the sidebar that you could do in DOS/Saturn/PS1/N64. Mad
Sega Saturn (704x512 & has 2x scaling internally or on emulator):

Older picture from Tore for C&C Sega Saturn (bad image):

Older picture from Tore for Sony Playstation 1 (bad image):

Last edited by djohe on Today, at 6:32 am; edited 3 times in total

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G-E
General


Joined: 09 Feb 2015

PostPosted: Mon Jul 08, 2019 6:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You guys are all bitching about a sidebar like you're still playing at 640x480...  guys this game is going to be a 1080p+ game for sure, there will be ample screen space.
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Lin Kuei Ominae
Seth


Joined: 16 Aug 2006
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Mon Jul 08, 2019 7:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are the Saturn version cameos bigger than the DOS ones?
DOS had only 32x24 icons, while these seem to be twice the size and closer to the size used in TS.
Is it possible to extract them? Would be nice for DTA to offer a "classic-icons" mode, as the realistic SVGA icons can be a bit too detailed/busy to quickly find the wanted object.
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djohe
Cyborg Artillery


Joined: 07 May 2006
Location: Sweden, Gothenburg

PostPosted: Mon Jul 08, 2019 5:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

G-E wrote:
You guys are all bitching about a sidebar like you're still playing at 640x480...  guys this game is going to be a 1080p+ game for sure, there will be ample screen space.
This is about the sidebars somewhat questionable design mostly and if the sidebar could be scaled to what people want it would fix the issue some people have with how much space of the screen it takes much like how UI/HUD can be resized in many games/programs out there.
Also what I said about ability to hide the sidebar was partially a joke but also a option/feature that has been removed that did no harm if it was left in imo.
Are you trying to start a fight or something, kinda seems like that when you throw "bitching" in there together with "like you're still playing at 640x480..."
Are we not allowed to have a nice discussion about design of stuff displayed on our monitors or what?
Lin Kuei Ominae wrote:
Are the Saturn version cameos bigger than the DOS ones?
DOS had only 32x24 icons, while these seem to be twice the size and closer to the size used in TS.
Is it possible to extract them? Would be nice for DTA to offer a "classic-icons" mode, as the realistic SVGA icons can be a bit too detailed/busy to quickly find the wanted object.
IIRC no they are not bigger but I am not 100% sure and IIRC I have no way of extracting them unless I take them from clean emulation screenshots of mine. (Cough the screenies I linked is not from me cough Tore did not want my clean emulated sceenies some year back cough)
Saturn just output higher resolution and did not have higher resolution assets beside the redbook CD music being much better. I might however be able to send you ripped copies of the discs tho for examination purposes, from what I remember the only thing really exposed on the saturn discs are videos and mission files and IIRC .wsa animations and some string file/s and the redbook CD audio.

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MasterHaosis
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Joined: 01 Nov 2010
Location: Serbia

PostPosted: Mon Jul 15, 2019 6:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://www.reddit.com/r/commandandconquer/comments/cdjlh1/remaster_update_and_red_alert_preview/
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TAK02
Commander


Joined: 28 Jun 2015
Location: It was Damascus.

PostPosted: Mon Jul 15, 2019 7:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MasterHaosis wrote:
https://www.reddit.com/r/commandandconquer/comments/cdjlh1/remaster_update_and_red_alert_preview/

Shiny mobile Tesla coil Very Happy

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Lin Kuei Ominae
Seth


Joined: 16 Aug 2006
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Mon Jul 15, 2019 7:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do they combine TD remastered and RA1 remastered into a single game?
Like DTA remastered?

The original concept had 1 or 2 little rings right above the roof and around the sphere, giving it the appearance of a squashed/shrunken tesla coil. That single "marble" doesn't give the tesla coil appearance imo (that matte texture would be better as a more shiny metallic one).
This looks more like a remake of the ingame version (that didn't show the rings), than using the more detailed original concept art, which would've been the better way to go imo.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 15, 2019 9:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aren't they going to be separate games?

He did bring up the double ring and asked if people would rather see it or a single ring. So far the comments said double

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Allen
Cyborg Specialist


Joined: 13 Feb 2007
Location: C:\Westwood\ TechLevel=12

PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is EA. The will be selling the double ring in a loot box with surprise mechanics....
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McPwny
Light Infantry


Joined: 29 Jan 2018

PostPosted: Sat Jul 20, 2019 12:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

it looks okay aesthetically, but its too thick. not really fond of that superweapons tab either.

theres also the enormous problem in the picture; the ea logo

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Exley
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Joined: 09 May 2011
Location: X-Files

PostPosted: Sat Jul 20, 2019 1:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

will these have full motion videos at all ?
do they have High quallity originals saved from past ?
or will we get the same ones resolution wise just better encoded ?
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