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Recreating YR in 3D
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YuriX
Medic


Joined: 14 Jan 2006

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 11:29 am    Post subject:  Recreating YR in 3D Reply with quote

The engine is still WiP & have been developping for 4 months. There are a lot of work to do. Smile


The cliffs are 3D models.
Some models are not done yet so the white parts are just the background(sky).

Old .tem, .sno, etc. is no supported. A new format is used. It allows models with tiles and double layered tiles.


The scene is lit in 3D dynamically.

Lit ramps.




It is going to support multi sides and countries. ATM side bar and loading screens have been defined in uimd.ini.



Maps
Old YR map are not supported directly but I had made a converter to convert them.
The main difference between old format and new format is the [IsoMapPack5] section. The new map format is still plain text INI.
I just use some original YR maps and cummunity made maps for testing. Wink


The Plug-in System
“Expandmd*.dll”s are recognized as plug-ins for the game. Written in C#, VB.Net or other .Net programming languages, such DLLs are used to extend the engine.

Here's an example:
the DLL can control the action of a button.

The dialog's layout is also in uimd.ini.

File System
Mix files are still supported for compatibility.
However you can get your own archive file format supported by writing a plug-in DLL.

ExLangmd*.mix: new files for langmd.mix can go here
ExThememd*.mix: new themes can be here


Graphic Resources
The engine will use 3D models in its own file format with an extension “.mesh”. This format contains extra information the engine will use.

A lot of 2D image formats are supported. Though SHP is one of them for compatibility, it is not suggested to use it. You can get rid of palettes( limited colors) if you don’t use it.


Things to do in the near future:
Make more cliffs.
Implement shadow mapping -- dynamic shadows
Implement TextBox, Dropdown, CheckBox for skirmish menu.
Implement more function for ingame UI. Then test pathfinding.
Interactive water.


BTW this engine needs a better name. Does anyone have ideas? #Tongue

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Deformat
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Joined: 17 Sep 2007
Location: Bucharest,Romania Posts:29240348568

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 11:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Woot,sexy #Tongue

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Shakar
Cyborg Cannon


Joined: 04 Jan 2008
Location: Underground

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 12:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

-Points to Secret's post- What he said O_O

This is something I'd defiantly play ^_^
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CCHyper
Defense Minister


Joined: 07 Apr 2005

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 1:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very nice, i have been watching your posts, hey have been interesting.

Looking forward to seeing what this turns into Wink

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NewGuy
Missile Trooper


Joined: 24 Feb 2008

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 1:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looks cool. Does this mean no voxel will work?
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Shakar
Cyborg Cannon


Joined: 04 Jan 2008
Location: Underground

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 1:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm thinking at least general's grade in graphics will be the minimum for this engine, so probably no VXLs... v.v But who knows, I'll be surprised if infantry SHPs are in here =P
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Gangster
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Joined: 11 Jun 2004
Location: Moscow, Russia

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 1:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Need a help ? Smile
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IcySon55
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Joined: 19 Nov 2003
Location: Overworld

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 2:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If he locks the camera to the standard YR angle and distance from the terrain, he can allow the game to be rotate to the 4 cardinal directions. Buildings that are not square would simply be mirrored. This would also work for infantry and voxels. Though the voxels would require a very fast draw method or too many would bring the game to snail's pace in no time at all.

If you've ever played Caesar 3, you'll understand the rotation I'm talking about.
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ViPr
Gauss Rifle Trooper


Joined: 30 Dec 2004

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 2:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

this is great. i've been waiting ages for someone to do this. now i'd like it to have first person view with each vehicle controlled by another player. kthnxbai.

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Dutchygamer
President


Joined: 18 Jun 2005
Location: Dordrecht, the Netherlands

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 3:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

All I can say is that you are doing a great job! Smile

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YuriX
Medic


Joined: 14 Jan 2006

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 3:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have ever tried to recover 3D models from voxels but without luck the result was disapointing so far. Check this post.

the engine doesn't support SHP units unless I implement Icy's idea.
I think i should make this in the future and put the camera's parameters into rulesmd.ini. Just giving options to do that. When it is in YR's view, 3d models and SHPs will co-exist(3d lighting won't affect SHPs). I will try but won't put this in the first place because there are still a lot of works to do ATM. Smile
And it's 3d by default.

ViPr wrote:
now i'd like it to have first person view with each vehicle controlled by another player.


Yeah, i'd like to fly jets then destory some land targets. Very Happy

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Ixonoclast
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Joined: 11 Aug 2008
Location: Somewhere up high.

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 4:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Did you put 3d graphics in YR? Or rebuild YR around a 3d engine?

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CCHyper
Defense Minister


Joined: 07 Apr 2005

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 4:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

...Hes made a new engine...

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Dny
Energy Commando


Joined: 28 May 2008
Location: California

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 7:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

good news i will be looking for it
Wish you the best of luck

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EVA-251
General


Joined: 20 Feb 2005
Location: Michigan

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 8:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looks simply incredible.

Makes me flashback to the 3d Doom Engines I would play.

Great work, good luck with getting the framework down.
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Blade
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Joined: 23 Dec 2003

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 9:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Out of interest, how will you be licensing the engine?

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AprilWar
Rocket Infantry


Joined: 05 Sep 2007
Location: Somewhere in rulesmd.ini

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 9:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very interesting. Good luck with this project.
How bout RA2: High Quality (RA2HQ) or RA2:3D Rolling Eyes
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DaFool
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Joined: 07 Nov 2006

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 10:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ra2+1(d)

YuriX's Revenge
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Suiseiseki
Commander


Joined: 06 Oct 2003

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 11:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How about the simple R3D? Added bonus of being able to stand for Red alert 3D and looking like 'Red'!

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Somebody Else
Cyborg Soldier


Joined: 05 Mar 2008

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 11:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Suiseiseki wrote:
How about the simple R3D? Added bonus of being able to stand for Red alert 3D and looking like 'Red'!


My favourite so far. That's some mighty impressive work there Smile
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Daz
Energy Commando


Joined: 26 Apr 2003

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 11:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This looks very promising.

Can you explain any more regarding how coding units/structures/etc will work in this?

And what are we looking at in the way of graphics for the above? (poly counts, how to export to your .mesh format, texture resolutions)
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Holy_Master
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Joined: 21 Jul 2004
Location: Thailand

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 11:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sound interesting but i need to know to programming to use this?

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ViPr
Gauss Rifle Trooper


Joined: 30 Dec 2004

PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 12:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Holy_Master wrote:
sound interesting but i need to know to programming to use this?


probably no. he could probably make his program read the game's ini files or someone can make a converter to automatically convert them to his format.

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NewGuy
Missile Trooper


Joined: 24 Feb 2008

PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 2:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

YuriX you could ask for some help. Ask VK his a good coder to. He wanted to create his own YR engine in a long time.
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YuriX
Medic


Joined: 14 Jan 2006

PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 6:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote


I have made more cliffs. Wink

Blade wrote:
Out of interest, how will you be licensing the engine?


Opensource at least. Maybe GPL but then you have to release your plug-ins' source.

Daz wrote:
And what are we looking at in the way of graphics for the above? (poly counts, how to export to your .mesh format, texture resolutions)


You can model them in your 3d program then export them to .obj/.x/etc.
Use this to get .mesh:

It an IDE for the engine and will be released. It contains editors/converters/etc.
So far the IDE is not user friendly enough because it is not intended to be public at the beginning of the development. It'll be imporved later.

Model'd better be low polygon models though the IDE can simplify them. Texture size can be whatever you want but too big texture will use lots of memory. Game will only run on higher-ended computers if so.

ViPr wrote:
he could probably make his program read the game's ini

Yea it reads the game's INIs. I will make coding units/structures/etc similiar to YR.




I think help on making content is OK.
Programing help is ok but this project have more than 70,000 lines of code so far. It will take sometime to understand the design. And also somgtime to understand each other's coding style.

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Gangster
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Joined: 11 Jun 2004
Location: Moscow, Russia

PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 7:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

<3

Where can i submit a content?
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Ickus
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Joined: 25 Nov 2002
Location: @__@

PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 7:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

whoa, that render does look pretty sexy! with the atmospheric perspective..

although low poly? hrm. although one can "fix" that using the plugsystem. what texture channels does it support? bump? normal?
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YuriX
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Joined: 14 Jan 2006

PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 7:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gangster wrote:
Where can i submit a content?


Oh thank you very much.
how about sending them to canbitwell[at]gmail.com?

Ickus wrote:

whoa, that render does look pretty sexy! with the atmospheric perspective. what texture channels does it support? bump? normal?


that's just an in-game screenshot.
4 texture channels are available,
You can set what effect one material will use. The textures will have different usages depending on the effect. Usually texture 1 is the color map, others are bump/normal/etc.

A simple example: normal mapping is one of the effects. when using this texture 2 will be the normal map.

Remember that the engine is extentable you can add and use your own effects.


btw now it's time to work on the shadows.

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Dupl3xxx
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Joined: 22 Aug 2006
Location: somewhere south of the north pole

PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 9:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This looks simply AWSOME! This is realy good! I will follow this further, in deed! Any further plans? Water, tunnels, bridges? view the battle from a units view? I'm learning textures now, and some basic 3d, so I will try to help Very Happy
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Grenadier


Joined: 30 May 2008

PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 10:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This topic is getting better. Somehow, the cliff's color is dark (charcoal?), which is annoying to look. The sky is better. #Tongue

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Daz
Energy Commando


Joined: 26 Apr 2003

PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 10:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

YuriX wrote:

It an IDE for the engine and will be released. It contains editors/converters/etc.
So far the IDE is not user friendly enough because it is not intended to be public at the beginning of the development. It'll be imporved later.


Excellent.
I foresee this being very popular.
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Ickus
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Joined: 25 Nov 2002
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 10:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
he cliff's color is dark (charcoal?), which is annoying to look.


they're untextured? Neutral
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Last edited by Ickus on Wed Aug 13, 2008 10:40 am; edited 1 time in total

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Daz
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Joined: 26 Apr 2003

PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 10:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

They look textured to me...
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Ickus
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 10:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

alright, they look like they have bump or something. but no color aside from that grey?..well let YuriX answer that one..

just the literal interpretations sometimes gets a bit irritating..when its clearly still WIP. oh well.
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Holy_Master
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Joined: 21 Jul 2004
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 11:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i think they have texture, but give it orange color to make it look more match. how ever overall look great have you plan to add some shadows?

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Daz
Energy Commando


Joined: 26 Apr 2003

PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 11:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

YuriX will you be releasing that voxel to model program?

While the models themselves aren't great for ingame they could be used as a good base to make an ingame model if you can get the models from your program into 3dsmax.
There's a program out there that does it already, but it ends up with poly counts that lag even on a quad core with an 8800GT so modelling around it is frustratingly slow.

Edit:
It takes all the pre-modelling work out of doing something like this.
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Soviet_Deso
Vehicle Drone


Joined: 22 Apr 2007

PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 6:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This looks amazing but the problem now is getting a team to create all the art assets, if you gonna work alone on this it will take you years to finish it. Good luck with this project, i would love to see this finished Smile

Nice model Daz but the rocket pack couldn't of been defined with a simple texture/bump map

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Daz
Energy Commando


Joined: 26 Apr 2003

PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 7:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah it could.
That model is about 900 triangles unoptimised, I can do a sweep of general optimisation and if the engine allows it a sweep of backface deletion.
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pd
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Joined: 19 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 7:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NewGuy wrote:
Looks cool. Does this mean no voxel will work?

Best thing you can do is to not support voxels, actually.

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Dupl3xxx
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Joined: 22 Aug 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 10:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As long as the Voxel to "3d" would work very well, the voxel format would only be used when modeling.
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Bako'Ikaporamee
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Joined: 29 Aug 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 11:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This could be damn interesting to mod once it's finished. Open source games are usually the best.
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ViPr
Gauss Rifle Trooper


Joined: 30 Dec 2004

PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 12:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i'm sorry to say but i predict this project will never be finished. how many other projects like this were cancelled?

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Suiseiseki
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Joined: 06 Oct 2003

PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 12:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ViPr wrote:
i'm sorry to say but i predict this project will never be finished. how many other projects like this were cancelled?


This is already further on than the rest ever got I believe.

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Dny
Energy Commando


Joined: 28 May 2008
Location: California

PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 1:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ViPr wrote:
i'm sorry to say but i predict this project will never be finished. how many other projects like this were cancelled?


Hey dont be soo negative

anyways hoo knows? this could become a success Very Happy

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DaFool
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Joined: 07 Nov 2006

PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 1:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Have you thought about water yet? Will it be like in ra2, where it's just a terrain type, or will the be depth and stuff?
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YuriX
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Joined: 14 Jan 2006

PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 4:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote


Shadow casted. Not just terrain any model can cast shadow if you like.
Looks a bit pixely though I used Percentage Closer Filtering. still needs improvment.

I think this pic tells something about the cliffs. Ingame cliff texture is recolored.




Daz wrote:
There's a program out there that does it already, but it ends up with poly counts that lag even on a quad core with an 8800GT so modelling around it is frustratingly slow.

Can your 3d modelling program simplifize them? I know 3dsmax can do it adding a Optimize modifier.

Daz wrote:
YuriX will you be releasing that voxel to model program?

I'll. Maybe texture generation is not included.


DaFool wrote:
Have you thought about water yet? Will it be like in ra2, where it's just a terrain type, or will the be depth and stuff?


Interactive but not clear water like RA3's. Maybe simpler than it for better peformance on older machines.

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Dupl3xxx
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Joined: 22 Aug 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 5:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The new "foto" looks good! But don't use the original cliffs, use those new dark ones.

And could "god rays" be included as a grafical option? would fit the cliffs Very Happy

clear six feet down, then dark sky or something? At least the coast should have a transistion from ground to deep water. Oh, and will moving/transforming terrain be included? Like the destroyable cliffs?
Also, you should try to duplicate the ice effect in TS Very Happy
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raminator
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Joined: 04 Oct 2005
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 8:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

@YuriX:
i guess different terrain will be created threw different texture sets...or will there be a hole set of "models" for each terrain set?

all that i can say now is that this looks pretty impressive =)
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AprilWar
Rocket Infantry


Joined: 05 Sep 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 8:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Amazing #Tongue

YOu should have your own development subforum =p
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Daz
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Joined: 26 Apr 2003

PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 9:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

YuriX wrote:

Can your 3d modelling program simplifize them? I know 3dsmax can do it adding a Optimize modifier.


Edit:
Attach list to attach all the individual cubes together makes things alot faster though you do lose the colours. Optimising does barely anything to the poly count (FALC is still 27000) but at least I can model without lag if the cubes are attached to each other.
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