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 Forum index » Modding Central » Red Alert 2 Editing Forum » Ares (Unofficial Forum)
Solid Building
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cxtian39
Cyborg Firebomber


Joined: 11 Feb 2016
Location: The United States of China

PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 9:34 pm    Post subject:   Solid Building Reply with quote

Ares Documentation:
Quote:
Units are aware of Solid Buildings, and they will try to find a better firing position when attacking a target and an obstacle is in the way

But sometimes they failed to do so, still hit the obstacle after they repositioned
They should reposition a little bit more...


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Last edited by cxtian39 on Thu Sep 29, 2016 8:06 am; edited 2 times in total

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G-E
General


Joined: 09 Feb 2015

PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 10:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The logic seems to be for a 3x3 building let's say, projectiles will only be blocked in the 3 cells across the building, if the enemy unit is just off to the side of that, like the opposing corner of the same side, it will shoot. Walls seem to have a special opacity however, still limited by explicit height though.

A unit's FLH will also affect whether it can shoot units over the crest of a 1-high ramp, or a wall, and even shoot buildings over other obstacles if tall enough. There's quite a bit of targeting logic in the game. So tall units can come in handy tactically.
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cxtian39
Cyborg Firebomber


Joined: 11 Feb 2016
Location: The United States of China

PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 8:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I tested with other projectiles. Only Inviso=yes projectile works correctly. I think it's because other projectiles are unpredictable. Though the unit is aware of the obstacle, it never knows the trajectory of its missile or arcing cannon, hence it doesn't know if it will hit the obstacle or not.
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AlexB
Cyborg Commando


Joined: 31 May 2010
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 3:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To find a proper firing position, the estimated trajectory has to be exactly like the actual trajectory the bullet will take. I can't recreate the computations, and you wouldn't have much fun with the game if I'd recode it anyhow.

So there always will be a small uncertainty, and it has actually been like that for years. Sometimes, units shoot at cliffs or slopes, not hitting the unit.

There's no "feedback loop", which might be a good approach to solve this (so a bullet detonating prematurely would tell the unit to move a bit), but I don't think this will happen.
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cxtian39
Cyborg Firebomber


Joined: 11 Feb 2016
Location: The United States of China

PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 7:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AlexB wrote:

There's no "feedback loop", which might be a good approach to solve this (so a bullet detonating prematurely would tell the unit to move a bit), but I don't think this will happen.


How about making projectiles unblockable, i.e. no collision size, pass through obstacles (buildings, cliffs, etc

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silverwind
Cyborg Soldier


Joined: 11 Jun 2016

PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 8:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cxtian39 wrote:
AlexB wrote:

There's no "feedback loop", which might be a good approach to solve this (so a bullet detonating prematurely would tell the unit to move a bit), but I don't think this will happen.


How about making projectiles unblockable, i.e. no collision size, pass through obstacles (buildings, cliffs, etc


If you're talking about disabling Solid Buildings logic for individual weapons, then:
Code:
SubjectToBuildings=no

This will make the game treat the projectile like it did in the vanilla game. No obstruction for this one.

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cxtian39
Cyborg Firebomber


Joined: 11 Feb 2016
Location: The United States of China

PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 9:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

But then the unit won't find a better position to fire.....


I wonder whether can make unit awareness a separate logic..
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silverwind
Cyborg Soldier


Joined: 11 Jun 2016

PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2016 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You're right. It won't move before firing. However, it'll be able to hit the target same as when fired from a different position.

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cxtian39
Cyborg Firebomber


Joined: 11 Feb 2016
Location: The United States of China

PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2016 8:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was thinking a scenario that the buildings don't have actual solid height, but the units think they have. Then the units will find a position good enough to fire, and the projectile won't be blocked due to inaccurate prediction.
When a player/observer sees the unit tries to avoid shooting at the obstacle, then he will assume that the obstacle has solid height, even though it can't block projectiles.
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